Results 1 to 19 of 19

Adding Lightness

This is a discussion on Adding Lightness within the General Help forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; So, my buddy just went out and bought a 2011 SS the other week, and while my car is for ...

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Southeast PA
    Posts
    139

    Black
    2000 Z28

    Adding Lightness

    So, my buddy just went out and bought a 2011 SS the other week, and while my car is for pretty certain faster (as it turns out, finding the road to figure this out is easier said than done...) I'm thinking that I might take some steps to make certain. Also, his car seems to have equal or better stopping power to mine.

    I figure my best bet to be a little quicker, both on acceleration and deceleration is to add some lightness to my car. I'm already topped out on my injectors - any more power requires new injectors - which makes making any more power a $2k+ project. I suppose that swapping to a C5 break setup would be an option to give me more stopping power...

    So, what are my best options out there to save some weight. I am bone stock in suspension and whatnot. It looks like I can go with a new front suspension kit - k-member, a arms, etc., but that looks like it only saves about 40lbs. Is there anything else I can do here.

    I was looking online at like Corbeau seats, but they're pretty pricey at $500 a pop for black leather, and its unclear 1, how much weight they'd save me, and 2 if they'd be remotely comfortable. Anyone have thoughts here?

    I do still want to be able to cruise around town in comfort, so removing my HVAC system isn't apealing to me...

  2. #2
    Member flybird's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Houston
    Posts
    408

    Mid Night Blue
    1999 Firebird 3.8 series

    Remove back seat? Remove jack / spare tire in the back?? aluminum drive shaft? That all will loose a good amount of weight

  3. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Southeast PA
    Posts
    139

    Black
    2000 Z28

    Back seats are already out - I forget what they weighed, but it surely wasn't a ton 15-20lbs total. The spare and jack are still in there, so yeah I could take them out - probably another 20 lbs.

    The driveshaft might be a pretty good idea, because not only is it weight, but its rotational weight too. Wonder what the weight savings is going to an aluminum. Looks like good bank for the $ too as I found 1 online pretty quickly for $420.

  4. #4
    Member flybird's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Houston
    Posts
    408

    Mid Night Blue
    1999 Firebird 3.8 series

    There you go buddy, that driveshaft is a real bang for your buck. Tell us how everything goes later.

  5. #5
    Senior Member INMY01TA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    The great red state of MD.
    Posts
    5,755

    Black
    2001 Trans Am (sold)

    If you're unsure that your car is faster than his 2011 SS at your current power level I don't see how your injectors could be maxed out. Head and cam cars are fine with stock injectors and much faster than a 2011 SS. As for weight, all of the above mods are good. Also remove the A.I.R. System and pump under the hood. AC delete saves alot too if you can live without it. Drag rims with skinnies up front help alot at the track.

  6. #6
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Southeast PA
    Posts
    139

    Black
    2000 Z28

    Well, I have more power than his car and less weight, which really should = faster, but he's planning on doing some easy boltons (ehx, intake) and a tune, which he says he's researched will get him to 500 at the crank and will save some weight from the exhaust system. The claimed 500 puts him ahead of me power wise, so I'm really just planning ahead. I have 400/400 at the wheels - I was told my injectors were nearly maxxed out on the top end by the guy who did the tune. That seems to be in direct conflict to saying that a h/c/i car can run w stock injectors, because that would imply my stock injectors can handle another 100hp worth of fuel.

    My AIR system and EGR systems are already gone.

    Like I said, I still want to be able to drive to work in the summer and stuff, so an AC delete isn't appealing.

  7. #7
    Member flybird's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Houston
    Posts
    408

    Mid Night Blue
    1999 Firebird 3.8 series

    I still say alum drive shaft

    Unless your wanting to to engine mods like headers or internal engine (which will be quite expensive)

  8. #8
    Spaz is My Mentor SMWS6TA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Ugy Lower Corner of AL
    Posts
    10,509

    Navy Blue Metallic
    98 T/A w/a little mods...

    I've gone against a 2011 Camaro 4 times with my setup and he walk all for times on me with no problems. It's going to take more then lighting the car to make up 100+ HP.

    Sorry to say it but you have very few options:

    C/H/I
    LQ4/9 with C/H/I
    LS2 or LS3 swap

    NO2 with any above
    lastly FI with any above

    Trade car in for a C6 Vette.

    And all of that won't matter unless you upgrade the rear and suspension, with exception to the Vette.
    http://www.ls1.com/forums/f7/my-6-liter-build-174257/

    http://www.ls1.com/forums/f8/my-8-8-rear-build-165553/

    6.0L Block - Forged 403 built, breaking it in , Polluter Stg3 Cam, FAST 102mm Intake, NW102 TB, MSD wires, NGK TR6 plugs, Truck Coil Packs, LS3 Fuel Injectors, CC Pacesetter LT Headers, TS&P ORY, QTP e-Cutout, Magnaflow Muffler, 104mm Air Lid & Line Lock, Catch Can, Stage 2 T56 w/Viper shaft, PRO 5.0 Shifter, Tick MC, Monster Stg 4 Clutch, QT SFI BH, MWC DSL, UMI: SFC, PHB, LCA's, LCA Relocation Brackets & TA, Hotchkis Springs (1" Drop), YR1 Snowflake Wheels wrapped in NT555 tires & Custom Fab Ford 8.8 rear w/4.10 Yukon Gears, WSQ Hood, 3"CM Strange Eng Drive Shaft.

    Horsepower never lies, but is often lied about!

  9. #9
    Member flybird's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Houston
    Posts
    408

    Mid Night Blue
    1999 Firebird 3.8 series

    ^^^ true

    Doesnt seem like he wants to get rid of the maro though. All he wants to do is loose weight. And as we all know, in every fbody weight plays a big factor. If I have a passenger in the car, I loose 0-60 time.

    But I do agree with you.lol

  10. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Southeast PA
    Posts
    139

    Black
    2000 Z28

    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    I've gone against a 2011 Camaro 4 times with my setup and he walk all for times on me with no problems. It's going to take more then lighting the car to make up 100+ HP.
    Why am I giving up 100+ HP? His car is factory rated at 426hp/420 tq. Lets assume that like all Camaros its underrated by a bit so as to not match the Vette... I have 402hp at the wheels, which by my calculations gives me 470ish, meaning he has approximately -(yes thats a minus sign, as in negative) 30 or so horsepower more than me. Also, my car is significantly lighter than his. His car, however, seems to brake better, and we both agree by our ass dyno that he's probably got more area under his tq (and therefore HP) curves.

    Honestly I think my best asset is the fact that his clutch sure seems to slip during WOT 1->2 and 2->3 shifts, whereas I have a RAM stage 3, so I can move thru the gears much cleaner.

    We're not gonna drag, we're much more likely to take 'em to a road course and try, then again, as of this summer(hopefully) when the new road course opens nearby, we do have both tracks within 20 miles of here...
    Last edited by gashkerwin; 02-26-2012 at 08:32 PM.

  11. #11
    Member flybird's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Houston
    Posts
    408

    Mid Night Blue
    1999 Firebird 3.8 series

    Ls6 clutch! Still going with the driveshaft! Haha maybe a 4:10 gear ratio rear end too

  12. #12
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Southeast PA
    Posts
    139

    Black
    2000 Z28

    Quote Originally Posted by flybird View Post
    Ls6 clutch! Still going with the driveshaft! Haha maybe a 4:10 gear ratio rear end too
    What good does an LS6 clutch do me? I already have a RAM Stage 3 clutch w/ billet flywheel, as I stated in my previous post. Isn't an LS6 clutch a pretty large step back in clamping force?

    I definitely plan to do more research into the driveshaft though.

  13. #13
    Member flybird's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Houston
    Posts
    408

    Mid Night Blue
    1999 Firebird 3.8 series

    Oh nevrmind, no ls6 clutch lol. But yeah driveshaft is a good step.

    Heck, if you race this guy ever, dont have a full tank of gas weighing you down. Id stay near a 1/4 tank!

    Goodluck man.

  14. #14
    Moderator 35th-ANV-SS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Wherever life takes me
    Posts
    12,465

    Red
    02 35th LE Camaro SS

    I have the stock AL drive shaft off my 02 35th LE Camaro SS. PM me if you're interested. It was removed from the car at 12K miles and it's been sitting in my basement the last 2 years.

  15. #15
    Spaz is My Mentor SMWS6TA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Ugy Lower Corner of AL
    Posts
    10,509

    Navy Blue Metallic
    98 T/A w/a little mods...

    Quote Originally Posted by gashkerwin View Post
    Why am I giving up 100+ HP? His car is factory rated at 426hp/420 tq. Lets assume that like all Camaros its underrated by a bit so as to not match the Vette... I have 402hp at the wheels, which by my calculations gives me 470ish, meaning he has approximately -(yes thats a minus sign, as in negative) 30 or so horsepower more than me. Also, my car is significantly lighter than his. His car, however, seems to brake better, and we both agree by our ass dyno that he's probably got more area under his tq (and therefore HP) curves.

    Honestly I think my best asset is the fact that his clutch sure seems to slip during WOT 1->2 and 2->3 shifts, whereas I have a RAM stage 3, so I can move thru the gears much cleaner.

    We're not gonna drag, we're much more likely to take 'em to a road course and try, then again, as of this summer(hopefully) when the new road course opens nearby, we do have both tracks within 20 miles of here...
    Please don't take what I'm saying as busting your balls.....

    I said the 100 hp difference by using the base line HP that GM put out officially. I know like every one else does that GM has a habit of under rating the HP for Camaro/Trans Am vs Corvettes when they have the same motor. Without knowing what your current mods are, I had to assume you are a stock LS1 vs his stock LS3. I see that you have had some mod work done but you didn't list it in the first post.

    When you say you have 402 at the wheels that makes you -20 hp to his 426 hp. GM does their HP rating at the wheels not at the crank.

    Now the mods I listed are what you will need to get your LS1 to just equal or just maybe pass his stock (only if he keeps it stock) pwr rating. However what you seem to not take into consideration is that to get a LS1 into 500 RWHP range takes almost all those mods in I recommended plus some serious suspension and rear end upgrades to get the power to the pavement and makes it a lot less DD friendly. Also you stated that he plans on doing some mods himself so that means you'll have even a harder time beating him. I'm not saying to not go for it, hell I want to beat the 5th GEN and new 5.0 myself one day but I know it will take much more then my LS1.

    Now if you do have more HP then him and are still losing what gears are you running with? You stated you have stock suspension, what about the rear? Upgraded 9" or 12 bolt? What is your torque rating on the dyno? << This could be how he's beating you. What cam are you running with?


    I've reread your post and it seems you want your car to be built for auto cross, is this correct? If so then really all you need is to upgrade braking, suspension and wheels and tires. Auto cross is a whole different type of racing and thought process. High HP and speed are not necessary what is needed to win. Look at the Mini coups, those little bastards win more then they lose. Speed control and maneuverability is what wins more then balls out.

  16. #16
    Senior Member INMY01TA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    The great red state of MD.
    Posts
    5,755

    Black
    2001 Trans Am (sold)

    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    GM does their HP rating at the wheels not at the crank.
    since when?

  17. #17
    Moderator 35th-ANV-SS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Wherever life takes me
    Posts
    12,465

    Red
    02 35th LE Camaro SS

    I would have to agree with Bill on this one. No way in hell a LS1 is rated at 325 HP at the wheel completely stock.

  18. #18
    Senior Member INMY01TA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    The great red state of MD.
    Posts
    5,755

    Black
    2001 Trans Am (sold)

    Or a C5 rated at 350.

  19. #19
    Moderator 35th-ANV-SS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Wherever life takes me
    Posts
    12,465

    Red
    02 35th LE Camaro SS

    If memory serves me correctly, most LS1 auto's DYNO in the 280's-290's range completely stock down to the filter. Manual's are in the low 300's range.

    Of course, every car is different and it depends on what kind of DYNO as well as some other factors.

    The problem is, most, if not all, of these cars have already been modified to some degree; exhaust, headers, lid, tune, etc. These basic bolt-on's provide a pretty significant HP increase.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Adding another DR
    By cuervo25_1 in forum Political / Debate Forum
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 05-26-2011, 10:41 PM
  2. Adding a pic
    By War Theory in forum Almost Anything Goes
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: 06-26-2009, 06:46 AM
  3. Adding amp and sub
    By 1st TA in forum Stereo and Electronics
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 11-15-2006, 07:14 PM
  4. adding decals...
    By SandmanWs7 in forum Appearance Section
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 11-13-2006, 06:44 PM
  5. adding horses???
    By Z_Duce_Eight in forum External Engine
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 10-10-2005, 09:47 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •