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2000 lS1 (Charging system issue/question)

This is a discussion on 2000 lS1 (Charging system issue/question) within the General Help forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; Howdy all, first off I wish to ask; can my model car (2000 LS1 Z28 Stock) My car fires up ...

  1. #1
    TerribleTed TerribleTed's Avatar
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    2000 lS1 (Charging system issue/question)

    Howdy all,
    first off I wish to ask; can my model car (2000 LS1 Z28 Stock) My car fires up jsut fine and stays running but when I check my battery term Voltages its not above 12 volts. I took my alternator into a show and it had issues and is now rebuilt. My battery is a red top type and is fully charged but I wish to now ask the following question:

    IF I start my car and it stays running & then disconnect the battery terminals will the car be able to stay running purely on alternator power (or do our cars by design not allow this). You see now that my alternator is fully rebuilt and all my connections to it are perfect, I still dont see when the car is runing and all things conected Volts over 12 VDC. So I wonder if I disconnect the battery while the car is running if it should still stay alive and not die real fast.

    This worked on my old 89 stang, but I am not sure if by design can work on my camaro.

    The alternator was fullly rebuilt and all connections are made correctly-the gauge voltage display shows it just barely into the red area and DVM measurements show 12 volts at best. me thinks I still have an alternator issue but now wonder if ite just my red top battery gone bad after 8 years of use?

    Help..

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    Electrical Engineer KMdef9's Avatar
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    Only 8 years out of a battery? More than enough time to take a dump.

    You should be reading near 14V when running.

    Did they replace the regulator when they did the rebuild?

    Did you get the battery tested as well?

  3. #3
    TerribleTed TerribleTed's Avatar
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    So I started my car and it fired up...after 5 mins of idling I removed the Negative batt cable and it died while removing it,,,I did this 2 times,,,I dont think its the battery since its a red top optima and seems to be charging fine (I will take it in and get it load tested in a few hours for sure).

    The alternator when they rebuilt it had all new parts installed, that being the windings brushes and bearings and I think the rectifier too...I shall call and check,,,but am assuming that the alternator when it left the rebuild shop was tested in there test device to make sure when it was spining had an output,,,

    So now I wonder about fusable link 11 (i see it called out in the schematics but have no clue to its physical location on my camaro)...of this I wonder,,,

    So after work its battery in the backpack and a ride on my zx14 to kragen for a batt drain test-then go from there with it. All I know is its cold outside and colder in the garage looking at my sick lady....

  4. #4
    Senior Member JayTA98's Avatar
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    I had issues with my vehicle since I got it. I tried replacing the alternator, battery and it didn't make any difference. I replaced the big 3 power cables and it made a little difference. My car showed 14 -15 volts until the radiator fans kick in. Then it drops to like 12v. If i idle it drops to 12 or less.

    There is a thread about people upgrading the alternator to the AC130 (i think thats the right number). Thats my next step when the other one goes bad.

  5. #5
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TerribleTed View Post
    Howdy all,
    first off I wish to ask; can my model car (2000 LS1 Z28 Stock) My car fires up jsut fine and stays running but when I check my battery term Voltages its not above 12 volts. I took my alternator into a show and it had issues and is now rebuilt. My battery is a red top type and is fully charged but I wish to now ask the following question:

    IF I start my car and it stays running & then disconnect the battery terminals will the car be able to stay running purely on alternator power (or do our cars by design not allow this). You see now that my alternator is fully rebuilt and all my connections to it are perfect, I still dont see when the car is runing and all things conected Volts over 12 VDC. So I wonder if I disconnect the battery while the car is running if it should still stay alive and not die real fast.

    This worked on my old 89 stang, but I am not sure if by design can work on my camaro.

    The alternator was fullly rebuilt and all connections are made correctly-the gauge voltage display shows it just barely into the red area and DVM measurements show 12 volts at best. me thinks I still have an alternator issue but now wonder if ite just my red top battery gone bad after 8 years of use?

    Help..
    Are you judging off the factory gauge or did you actually use a volt meter?

    You can do a simple test with a volt meter. When the car is not running, connect the volt meter to the pos/neg terminals on the battery. A well charged battery should read somewhere over 12 volts, even 13.

    Next start the car, run the same test with the volt meter, you will see just exactly how much charging power is reaching the battery. Should read over 14 volts on the meter.

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    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JayTA98 View Post
    I had issues with my vehicle since I got it. I tried replacing the alternator, battery and it didn't make any difference. I replaced the big 3 power cables and it made a little difference. My car showed 14 -15 volts until the radiator fans kick in. Then it drops to like 12v. If i idle it drops to 12 or less. .
    That sounds pretty normal to me. Again use the volt meter test before tossing money at it. The cars gauge may not be the most accurate.

    If you are idling with fans running, radio on, A/C, or even just the blower fan, turn signals, running lights etc....any of these things will tax the system, and at idle it's not unusual to see the gauge drop to 12 volts or so. As soon as the car comes off idle however the gauge should immediately pick up to around 14 volts give or take.

    I've used an underdrive pulley on mine in the past for a couple of years, talk about voltage drop while idling. I never had an issue with charging the battery in any driving conditions however.

  7. #7
    TerribleTed TerribleTed's Avatar
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    all measurements were with a DVM and the battery needs to get load tested for sure to rule it out as causing my system to have issues. I shall remove it and load test it within the next hours or so-then go from there,,,
    I think that the problem is either the battery or the alternator,,I sure hope that its one of them,,,I will do the tear down this time on my alternator and do all future rebuilds to it myself. I can mix up a great V/O so therefore I can rebuild a alternator,,,ha ha

  8. #8
    Member lowrider095's Avatar
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    do you have a under drive pulley on the crank

  9. #9
    TerribleTed TerribleTed's Avatar
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    as my original post said its a stock Z28...
    anyway,,,the batter was load tested and failed but not by much,,so I bought another red top optima and it was fully charged and still when in the car did not fix it,,,
    Its got to be the alternator...even if I tookit to a place that always did great quality work on my other starters and alternators from other cars,,,,Its got to be the alternator,,,,so out I shall yank it and get out my good books and do the alternator tear down myself and see whats up.

    I shall make a posting of my findings in the next day or so,,,anyway the optima battery I turned in as a core and the new one are not the issue,,its got to be th alternator or my car is possesed

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    Member lowrider095's Avatar
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    why don't you take it to get load tested too

  11. #11
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Alternators are simple. You'll have a voltage regulator (internal in this case) Diodes and brushes.

    The voltage regulator could be an issue, sometimes they are not replaced during an alternator rebuild. They do cause funky voltage readings. 9 out of 10 times they are the cause of a faulty alternator. Cheap and easy to replace, and can be bought seperately.

    Diodes, well when I've had those go bad, the only symptom I ever had was a dead car battery after sitting overnight. Seems one of the diodes would short and pull the battery down. Never had one give me a charging problem however.

    Brushes are just that,,,small little rectangular pieces (like led) with a wire attached, spring loaded to push them against the armature. These are always replaced with new ones during a rebuild. If they are worn down to nothing, they weren't replaced.

    Only other pieces to replace that usually come in a rebuild kit are the bearings that either end of the shaft ride on. Some places don't bother to press them out and replace them. Really nothing to it.

    Starters are even easier.

  12. #12
    TerribleTed TerribleTed's Avatar
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    I know the inner workings of the alternator...thanks for the added data on them too.

    The removal of my alternator should be less then 15 mins this time (I am getting good at this now). Then I will take it to Kragen or Autzone for a alternator load test and if it passes ouch,,,if it fails then its lovin time with the alternator..I shall get in side it and find whats wrong. The diode array I can check with my DMM, the brushes are new. I would guess that the insides of the alternator shall be fun time,,,I just hope its a problem with the voltage regulator or diode array. Since all connections to and from the alternator and battery seem fine. With a new battery in it I pray its the alternator.

  13. #13
    TerribleTed TerribleTed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TerribleTed View Post
    I know the inner workings of the alternator...thanks for the added data on them too.

    The removal of my alternator should be less then 15 mins this time (I am getting good at this now). Then I will take it to Kragen or Autzone for a alternator load test and if it passes ouch,,,if it fails then its lovin time with the alternator..I shall get in side it and find whats wrong. The diode array I can check with my DMM, the brushes are new. I would guess that the insides of the alternator shall be fun time,,,I just hope its a problem with the voltage regulator or diode array. Since all connections to and from the alternator and battery seem fine. With a new battery in it I pray its the alternator.
    Well the buchers toll and the learning curve and the data to pass on to newbies,,,,(In the history of my car I have already had a major (massive) PS leak which killed my alternator, so it was rebuilt,,,then installed and run fine,,also I replaced that PS pump and thought I cleaned out the PS lines well enough,,anyway,,,a year later and a small PS leak I found,,then the check gauges light and WOW,,,battery Volts shoed in the red,,,so out came that alternator,,and in for arebuild again,,they shown me the scorched parts and soaked brushes,,,and that small leak from PS was the most likely cause,,,,so a rebuild they did,,,

    Now the install was easy,,but that little red wire that comes out of that 4 pin connector on my alt got fudged up,,only I did not find it this way till I pulled the alt again,,,

    So to finish up the posting,,,that little red wire is a bugger to the charging system so make sure its connected well or that car wont charge,,,even if the alt is brand new,

    I suggest to all to extend the Main AThick Positive Alt wire a few inches,,then extend the little red (excite wire some call it) extend that a few inches as well, this way when you unbolt the alt you have room to get the rear connector unconnected and have enough room to unblto the main large thick wire,,and use a good amount of dielectric grease on all connections,,and that splash sheild,,,its needed,,,

    But now I need to do a final PS repair,,,and its going to be a prety modified one too,,later all

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    ALT upgrade.....in pics

    not 1 person has suggested the truck alt???

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  16. #16
    Firebird Encyclopedia 9T8W66's Avatar
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    When the Optima was load tested what was the Voltage reading ?

    Any battery with a voltmeter reading under 12.55 should NOT be load tested. Anything above 12.60 is considered a good charge. Did they use a real Carbon Pile or did they use a handheld ?

    I work for Interstate Batteries and we sell Optima's (both are made by Johnson Controls) and I wouldn't waste my time with one. For the half the money you would be better off with a regular ACID battery.
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  17. #17
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9T8W66 View Post
    I work for Interstate Batteries and we sell Optima's (both are made by Johnson Controls) and I wouldn't waste my time with one. For the half the money you would be better off with a regular ACID battery.
    I don't care for them either. Don't like the way they are made, funky shape that doesn't fit correctly, and comes with cheesy snap on pieces of plastic to square up the bottoms for the clamps to work, then they still don't.
    Then there is the "One size fits all" crap. Ya,,,that works

    Then there is the,,,,,I'll just quit complaining,,,nevermind

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    expensive tires az gt eater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TerribleTed View Post
    Well the buchers toll and the learning curve and the data to pass on to newbies,,,,(In the history of my car I have already had a major (massive) PS leak which killed my alternator, so it was rebuilt,,,then installed and run fine,,also I replaced that PS pump and thought I cleaned out the PS lines well enough,,anyway,,,a year later and a small PS leak I found,,then the check gauges light and WOW,,,battery Volts shoed in the red,,,so out came that alternator,,and in for arebuild again,,they shown me the scorched parts and soaked brushes,,,and that small leak from PS was the most likely cause,,,,so a rebuild they did,,,

    Now the install was easy,,but that little red wire that comes out of that 4 pin connector on my alt got fudged up,,only I did not find it this way till I pulled the alt again,,,

    So to finish up the posting,,,that little red wire is a bugger to the charging system so make sure its connected well or that car wont charge,,,even if the alt is brand new,

    I suggest to all to extend the Main AThick Positive Alt wire a few inches,,then extend the little red (excite wire some call it) extend that a few inches as well, this way when you unbolt the alt you have room to get the rear connector unconnected and have enough room to unblto the main large thick wire,,and use a good amount of dielectric grease on all connections,,and that splash sheild,,,its needed,,,

    But now I need to do a final PS repair,,,and its going to be a prety modified one too,,later all
    I found that wire had to be repinned both times I've had my alt out.By the way, that plug can be rebuilt easily. Second time, I put a quick connect long enough, I can disconnect it from the top by the heads. Way easier. I just put all the extra wire in the loom. And I also installed a capacitor for the amplifier that powers my sub.

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