Need educating on the reality of buffering/scrutinizing auto detailing.

[Pyromaniacal]

I'm posting this because I really want a break down on how to cut and buffer my BLACK '02 Trans Am using an orbital washer. Along with that, I'm interested to know when the proper time would be in the process to apply corrective paint. I plan on using these techniques I learn here on my '02 and I want my knowledge to be complete as possible when I do bring 'er under the knife.

Lets start first by what procedures should be taken to ensure complete paint safety? I have heard that a heavy or a lazy hand with the orbital washer can cause severe paint damage and great care must be taken. This rumor is actually the very reason why I'm posting this now! Any advisories, past experiences, are welcome! I want to go into this with full knowledge!!

Secondly, what products do you all recommend? The swirlies/scratches are pretty bad on my car unfortunately, so stronger products I will probably need.

Thirdly, my car has had the shit driven out of it through its life (a lotta hwy miles ><) so my understanding is this process is going to go like this.

Washdown, claybar, 50/50 dawn/water wash, orbital washer, rewash?, reapply polish, stand in awe at the work.

So now, during this process, would it be wise to apply corrective paint after the claybaring process, or before it?

I have numerous hood chips that I want to attack with a corrective paint set, I believe I have heard of a set that gives you a small pen tool so you can nitpick the littlest marks, if anyone knows the name of this, please divulge that information.

Fourthly, I have the stock '02 aluminum rims, and I am interested in what products would be the most effective at gaining, and keeping the shine that they have? I have been using Eagle aluminum wheel cleaner but it leaves a haze and it bugs the fuck out of me.

Fifthly, the biggest auto detailing conundrum aside from how to get the spider webs out of my paint for me has been how to effectively clean the windows. I have used the obvious technique with Windex, to little avail. It leaves behind streaks that drive me insane no matter how hard I try to get rid of them, so how would I effectively clean the windows?

Any other advice, anything at all any of you can add would be greatly appreciated. I am HIGHLY passionate of my car and I *HATE* the way the paint looks, throughout my time owning it I've washed it no less than 3 times a week, dedicating no less than an hour of my time to it each time, even the smallest water spots are unacceptable to me! The previous owner was careless, however I love my baby and the damage he left behind will be tended to with loving hands.

I appreciate any advice you all can give, and thank you all so much in helping me expand my knowledge.

[Z06-Goose]

I'm far from a Pro, but I have done a couples of fbodies and I can share my experience...
That said, it's hard for me to see what your paint looks like, but I do know how hard the clearcoat on the f-bodies is...you can follow my experience below, and then make adjustments as you go if the swirls are bad, or are just surface swirls

Start with the orange pad -assuming you have the LC pads- prime the pad (a couple of squirts from a QD should do) then apply two small lines of polish across the pad. Set the PC on the paint and with the PC off, spread it along the area you'll be working until the polish has spread out nicely where it wouldn't sling
With the speed set at 3, and PC flat on the paint, turn the PC on and work the area in a zig-zag motion, up and down, side by side in overlapping slow motions to cover the area well. Use at least two passes at low speed. Then, crank your PC to 5 and work the area again in the same manner...working the polish in until it has broken down, and ready to remove with a microfiber

You could set the speed at 6 which is the max, or work it at 5-5.5. I'd suggest working at 5 to start while you get the hang of it

The severity of the swirls will dictate the pace and pressure you're going to be working the PC and polish on the affected area. You can move it at about 1" per second if you have some nice swirls
Keep working the polish until it's gone clear/translucent, it may dust a bit, just depends on the polish you're using. If you have a spray bottle of 50/50 IPA/H2O mix, you can spray on your work area to remove dust, and clean off the polish and see the progress you've made. That will tell you how to go about on the second pass, and what areas need more attention
Keep the pad flat on the paint at all time. You never want to lift the PC up while is running; ask me how I know
Use caution when working around the air vents and ram-air area, you'd probably want to work that area with the PC set at 4
Just keep working your way around the car this way while you check your work. There's really nothing to it, as long as you have patient to work the polish in (breakdown) to allow it to do its job you'll be doing fine

After you're done with polishing, taking out all the swirls and what not, I would recommend follow up with some Red Moose Glaze if using a carnauba wax, or Prima Amigo (polymer glaze) that will work great under sealants without bonding issues, or durability; the Prima Amigo will clean off polish oil. It works great under under waxes as well
To apply the glaze, when I use Prima Amigo, I use either a polishing pad (white) or the black finish pad at about 4.5-5.0 speed. Work it in the same way as the polish, but longer strokes, and at a slightly faster pace -remember to keep the pad flat on the paint-

If using RMG, same as above but I use the finishing pad only

For swirl removal, I'd recommend Menzerna SIP (Super Intensive Polish) or Prima Swirl

PS: The PC is actually a pretty safe instrument to use. It won't damage or burn your paint. Only human error can cause the PC to do damage to your paint; like dropping it on the car, running it at too high speed on tight places like between or inside fog lights cavities, air dam

To clean the windows, I like Stoners Invisible Glass on pump spray bottle, though the aerosol can works fine as well, I just like the pump spray better
When cleaning the windows, you may use a technique that can save you a little time; if cleaning the inside, you can go on a side-to-side motion, do the outside in an up-and-down motion, that way when it's all done, if you still see some streaks, you'll know what side they're on. Use a clean white towel to clean your windows if possible

For wheels, anything designed to clean wheels should work about the same. You could do a soap and water scrub down first if that's the safer route if your wheels are uncoated. You could then apply sealant after they're clean. I use the same sealant I use on my paint on my wheels, it repels water, and makes it easier to rinse off the crud next time around

[Pyromaniacal]

Let me first start by saying, thank you so much for your detailed write up on this!!

I am understanding this a lot better now, it doesn't seem so daunting when you put it the way you do. So the standard Porter Cable polisher should do the trick? With Menzerna SIP going down first, do I not even need to claybar the paint first? I have Zaino that I paid good money for, and despite the claims I still plan on putting it on after this, will it even be necessary though?

And I might as well throw this one out, when talking about polish and wax, are they two different things entirely? Do both need to be done in the complete paint detailing process? If so, I would love a recommendation on a solid wax to use in conjunction with Zaino.

Also, about the corrective paint, whats your recommendation on when exactly to use it during this process?

Again, thanks so much, I am in your debt for your time spent and knowledge shared.

[Pyromaniacal]

Btw, could you link me the PC that you speak of? I'm trying to find the exact right one to buy, my confidence level is increasing to the point where I want to get this done - tomorrow.

[Z06-Goose]

Let me first start by saying, thank you so much for your detailed write up on this!!

I am understanding this a lot better now, it doesn't seem so daunting when you put it the way you do. So the standard Porter Cable polisher should do the trick? With Menzerna SIP going down first, do I not even need to claybar the paint first? I have Zaino that I paid good money for, and despite the claims I still plan on putting it on after this, will it even be necessary though?

And I might as well throw this one out, when talking about polish and wax, are they two different things entirely? Do both need to be done in the complete paint detailing process? If so, I would love a recommendation on a solid wax to use in conjunction with Zaino.

Also, about the corrective paint, whats your recommendation on when exactly to use it during this process?

Again, thanks so much, I am in your debt for your time spent and knowledge shared.

Yes, absolutely do a claybar first. What Zaino products do you have?
If you have the ZPC-Fusion already, that can work with the orange pad. The ZPC doesn't have the cutting power of the SIP, but it will take more time to do, and it finishes well. That is if you have the Z-PC already, otherwise I'd look into getting some Menzerna instead
If you still want to use Zaino, you can do that after polishing. Just use 50/50 to clean up the wax residue, or another carwash after that so that the Zaino can bond to the paint

Zaino is actually a sealant, not a polish. They just call it polish for some reason. A polish is what you use to correct paint defects. Zaino as I said is a sealant, and you can apply it as your last step after you're done polishing.
Don't need wax, though you could use a good quality wax over Zaino once it has fully cured, but not necessary

The proper paint care system, or at least when you're ready to do it right is something like this:
1- wash with a good car shampoo
2- clay bar
3- wipedown claybar residue
4- polish swirls out
5- 50/50 wipedown, or another carwash
6- glaze (this optional)
7- wax or sealant

Polish, wax, glaze and sealant are four different things

Polish corrects defects. Wax is a carnuaba natural product.
Glazes are man-made products that can have a high carnuaba and oil content and enhance the gloss and depth after polishing, but offer no protection, and should be topped with a wax. It can also be polymer based (less carnuaba/oil content) and it's also good to fill-in minor swirl marks after polishing. Some sealants will not bond well to carnuaba based glazes, but will do well with a polymer based glaze as well as waxes
Sealants are man-made "wax" with a nice shine and more durable than regular waxes. They require a cleaner surface free of waxes or oil to cross-link and bond to the paint which will make it more durable

A PC (orbital buffer) though a good tool doesn't hold a candle to a rotary buffer. Rotary buffer makes the job easier, faster, and overall more effective, but it has his cons, you'd need to be well-versed in using one as it can burn the paint, cause holograms if used improperly

[Z06-Goose]

Btw, could you link me the PC that you speak of? I'm trying to find the exact right one to buy, my confidence level is increasing to the point where I want to get this done - tomorrow.

Check this link. They have the best package deal on PC
http://www.autogeek.net/po.html

Also, I believe they're having a 15% off this weekend...
Use the coupon code PBMA15 to receive 15% off your order. Sale ends on Saturday, June 30, 2007

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/...time-sale.html

[Pyromaniacal]

You continually provide me with first class assistance, my friend. That coupon code has managed to save me 27$ off the total price of the 7424. To my dismay I found that it does not exist in stores, so I must wait to do the polishing work I wish to do.

I decided to go with the Pinnacle Twins + CCS Pads 7424 Kit, looks like it can get the job done with my Zaino going over it to seal it all up. Btw I don't have the Fusion, thats a new product they come out with shortly after I bought their complete kit for around $100 back in Jan. It gave my car an epic shine, but did nothing for the swirls. I bought it solely for that purpose so you can imagine my disappointment, shortly after I realized that I had the wrong idea about it from the get-go, sucks when that happens, eh?

Btw, the last question I have that you didn't go over is about the corrective paint, in the process that you wrote up, when should it be applied? And do you know perhaps which one I should use? I have a bunch of small hood chips that need help, I've heard of one with a small pen attachment, thats what I would need, without a doubt.

Someone should sticky this post, don't ya think? Haha who knows, maybe I'm the last guy on all of LS1.com who doesn't understand this!

[Z06-Goose]

You continually provide me with first class assistance, my friend. That coupon code has managed to save me 27$ off the total price of the 7424. To my dismay I found that it does not exist in stores, so I must wait to do the polishing work I wish to do.

I decided to go with the Pinnacle Twins + CCS Pads 7424 Kit, looks like it can get the job done with my Zaino going over it to seal it all up. Btw I don't have the Fusion, thats a new product they come out with shortly after I bought their complete kit for around $100 back in Jan. It gave my car an epic shine, but did nothing for the swirls. I bought it solely for that purpose so you can imagine my disappointment, shortly after I realized that I had the wrong idea about it from the get-go, sucks when that happens, eh?

Btw, the last question I have that you didn't go over is about the corrective paint, in the process that you wrote up, when should it be applied? And do you know perhaps which one I should use? I have a bunch of small hood chips that need help, I've heard of one with a small pen attachment, thats what I would need, without a doubt.

Someone should sticky this post, don't ya think? Haha who knows, maybe I'm the last guy on all of LS1.com who doesn't understand this!

You can use the Pinnacle Advance Swirl Remover after you claybar. Then the other Pinnacle Finishing Polish to follow after the PASR with a polishing pad (white pad) or you may try with the finishing pad
I hope that answer your question;
1- wash with a good car shampoo
2- clay bar
3- wipedown claybar residue
4- polish swirls out with the PASR
5- 50/50 wipedown, or another carwash
6- glaze (this optional) Use the Pinnacle Finishing Polish here instead of a Glaze
7- wax or sealant



I think they have some instructional videos on how to use the PC on the same page you looked at the PC deals. Take the time to view those for more tips...

[trans-am nut]

I just saw that video on how to use the pc,thanks I finially have an understanding of how it works. What do you think of the pinnacle products?

[Z06-Goose]

I just saw that video on how to use the pc,thanks I finially have an understanding of how it works. What do you think of the pinnacle products?

Pinnacle, though haven't used it personally, I think is a great product line. I keep hearing good things of their crystal mist spray. The Pinnacle Paste Wax is regarded as one of the best waxes in the world, that should tell you something...

[trans-am nut]

Great thanks I will have to pick some up

[Pyromaniacal]

I got that Porter Cable today, now I am confused as to how to make the orange pads work? I have the white attachment meant for bonnets n the like, the pads seem like they are totally useless, I'm unsure of what to do rofl. How do I make these things work? I'm going to be furious if I bought that whole package for nothing and I don't have what it takes to make those pads work.

[Z06-Goose]

I got that Porter Cable today, now I am confused as to how to make the orange pads work? I have the white attachment meant for bonnets n the like, the pads seem like they are totally useless, I'm unsure of what to do rofl. How do I make these things work? I'm going to be furious if I bought that whole package for nothing and I don't have what it takes to make those pads work.

The pads ae velcro backed. You need to connect the backing plate to the PC. It's the yellow disc. Tighten it secure in place, and the pads attach to backing plate (Velcro'd)
You should have gotten a small wrench. You could also had received a white pad that is non-velcro'd you don't need to have that on, you could use it later on if you want to, but for now, all you need is the backing plate attached, so you can use your other pads

[Pyromaniacal]

Isn't that just grand, they mention in smaller letters on that page that I need to buy the backing plate seperately.... grr! My detailing operation is further delayed.. Could I buy this in stores or do I need to order it online?

[Z06-Goose]

Isn't that just grand, they mention in smaller letters on that page that I need to buy the backing plate seperately.... grr! My detailing operation is further delayed.. Could I buy this in stores or do I need to order it online?

That really surprises me. Your order didn't come with the backing plate?
Which kit did you buy, and from whom?

[Pyromaniacal]

Autogeek, the Pinnacle Twins kit, it really says right on there that I need to buy the backing plate seperately, it was a novice mistake on my behalf not reading that shit. I can't help but be unhappy anyways, you think I could buy this in stores so I don't have to fk with shipping?

[Z06-Goose]

Autogeek, the Pinnacle Twins kit, it really says right on there that I need to buy the backing plate seperately, it was a novice mistake on my behalf not reading that shit. I can't help but be unhappy anyways, you think I could buy this in stores so I don't have to fk with shipping?

I'm not sure who may sell it locally...

[Pyromaniacal]

I'm not sure who may sell it locally...

is all I have to say to this.

[BDowning]

Find someone in your area that sells Auto Paint Supplies and they Will have the backing pad!!

[LETHALxLS1]

is all I have to say to this.

LOL get used to it buddy hahahaha I have