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auto vs manual

This is a discussion on auto vs manual within the GTO forums, part of the Vehicle Specific category; Originally Posted by GTO1_OHIO Increasing or decreasing the line pressure on a OEM tranny is the quickest way to burning ...

  1. #21
    Nitrous Tuner LS2Tuner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTO1_OHIO View Post
    Increasing or decreasing the line pressure on a OEM tranny is the quickest way to burning up a clutch pack.
    Sorry to inform you there but obviously your misinformed!!
    By boosting line pressure your actually decreasing clutch slippage by increasing applied pressure which = lower temps.......... Thats why it's a proven fact that shift kits increase tranny life!!
    Temp. is the #1 killer for auto trannys.

    Sorry to burst your bubble there but someone has mis guided you for sure on this matter.
    Don't be afraid of the bottle!!! Be afraid of your tune!!!

  2. #22
    Member GTO1_OHIO's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LS2Tuner View Post
    Sorry to inform you there but obviously your misinformed!!
    By boosting line pressure your actually decreasing clutch slippage by increasing applied pressure which = lower temps.......... Thats why it's a proven fact that shift kits increase tranny life!!
    Temp. is the #1 killer for auto trannys.

    Sorry to burst your bubble there but someone has mis guided you for sure on this matter.

    Misinformed not. From what I've been told temp, pressure and higher RPMs all can contribute.

    Did I ever say a thing about temps? No. Let look at my car for a bit. My tranny temps ran under 170 degrees constantly even in 90+ degree heat. Pressure regulation is what caused my problems...plain and simple. And yes my tuner raised mine. And for your information several rebuilders told me that not only does higher pressure work the pump harder but it also increases operating temps as a result of it. Personally Rossler installed a pressure modulator in mine when they did my rebuild so I didn't have pressure problems again but then again I'm not stock.

    Secondly did you recommend putting in a shift kit, which by the way many tranny places do not recommend? NO, you said raise the line pressure period. I said too much pressure = bad, Too little = bad. You just blantly recommended raising the pressure as something wonderful. Guess you must be smarter then the GM engineering team. Too many tuners tell people to just raise line pressure and change their shift points. But what they fail to tell is that anybody that does just a little research on the subject will find out is that doing just that will wear out a tranny faster...now thats a fact. You going to dispute that?

  3. #23
    The Bandit Wesman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 99hoss View Post
    Manuals impress high school kids...Automatics win races.
    Oh no...can of worms opened...

    With a competent driver operating the M6, stock for stock the manual car will be faster. Its simple physics, really. More power to the ground, better gear ratios, less slippage = faster.

    Obviously with mods anything can change. T56 Rebuilds is running low 9's at 149MPH in their M6 car, bullshit "automatics win races"

  4. #24
    Nitrous Tuner LS2Tuner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTO1_OHIO View Post
    Misinformed not. From what I've been told temp, pressure and higher RPMs all can contribute.

    Did I ever say a thing about temps? No. Let look at my car for a bit. My tranny temps ran under 170 degrees constantly even in 90+ degree heat. Pressure regulation is what caused my problems...plain and simple. And yes my tuner raised mine. And for your information several rebuilders told me that not only does higher pressure work the pump harder but it also increases operating temps as a result of it. Personally Rossler installed a pressure modulator in mine when they did my rebuild so I didn't have pressure problems again but then again I'm not stock.

    Secondly did you recommend putting in a shift kit, which by the way many tranny places do not recommend? NO, you said raise the line pressure period. I said too much pressure = bad, Too little = bad. You just blantly recommended raising the pressure as something wonderful. Guess you must be smarter then the GM engineering team. Too many tuners tell people to just raise line pressure and change their shift points. But what they fail to tell is that anybody that does just a little research on the subject will find out is that doing just that will wear out a tranny faster...now thats a fact. You going to dispute that?
    Well ......... I guess you have already got your facts straight from people who build race trannys and deal with high horsepower applications on a regular bassis...................
    NO MORE RESPONSE NEEDED ON MY PART.
    I THINK MEMBERS ON THIS SITE KNOW HOW STUPID I AM WITH MY GUIDENCE AND RESPONSES TO FELLOW MEMBERS.

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    Junior Member 99hoss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wesman View Post
    Oh no...can of worms opened...

    With a competent driver operating the M6, stock for stock the manual car will be faster. Its simple physics, really. More power to the ground, better gear ratios, less slippage = faster.

    Obviously with mods anything can change. T56 Rebuilds is running low 9's at 149MPH in their M6 car, bullshit "automatics win races"
    Yeah and there's very FEW drivers out there that can really shift a manual and the one's that say they can are full of shit most of the time so 9 out of 10 times you will smoke a manual driver because they still think there driving there daddy's OLD JOHN DEERE

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    car enthusiast djvaly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wesman View Post
    Oh no...can of worms opened...

    With a competent driver operating the M6, stock for stock the manual car will be faster. Its simple physics, really. More power to the ground, better gear ratios, less slippage = faster.

    Obviously with mods anything can change. T56 Rebuilds is running low 9's at 149MPH in their M6 car, bullshit "automatics win races"
    M6 don't slip, only A4 do.

  7. #27
    The Bandit Wesman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djvaly View Post
    M6 don't slip, only A4 do.
    I was referring to the clutch on the manual, not the transmission. When you launch and shift you slip the clutch somewhat.

    Auto's lose power in the torque converter, which slips a lot.

  8. #28
    car enthusiast djvaly's Avatar
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    the stall robs 20rwhp

  9. #29
    Member GTO1_OHIO's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LS2Tuner View Post
    Well ......... I guess you have already got your facts straight from people who build race trannys and deal with high horsepower applications on a regular bassis...................
    NO MORE RESPONSE NEEDED ON MY PART.
    I THINK MEMBERS ON THIS SITE KNOW HOW STUPID I AM WITH MY GUIDENCE AND RESPONSES TO FELLOW MEMBERS.
    I'm sure that your mature response has boosted their faith in your advice.
    10.954 123.58 1.496 489.29 rwhp 475.52 rwtq

  10. #30
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    Shift kits do improve auto trannys life.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 99hoss View Post
    Manuals impress high school kids...Automatics win races.
    Then why have all the auto's I raced always lost?

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTO1_OHIO View Post
    I'm sure that your mature response has boosted their faith in your advice.
    I still have great faith in his advise. I also have some information that I can share with you. Upping your line pressure IS a GOOD thing because as LS2Tuner said it creates less heat. Any GOOD TUNER such as he mentioned should know a good point to set a stock transmission at. He never did say turn up your line pressure as high as it will go in a 500rwhp car now did he? The only reason that would ever be a bad thing is if your clutch bands are already worn or you have reached a horsepower rating that exceeds that of which your transmission can handle. For instance, my transmission was mildly built however stupidly enough I delayed putting a cooler on it and then went from delayed to never and after 10,000 miles my transmission was blown. How did it happen? My transmission was ALREADY slipping due to the heat in my trans cause by my stall. I figured I would try and remedy this on my own by turning up the line pressure as far as it will go and I blew the band off my second gear because I put to much power to an already weakened transmission on a 150 shot at the track. Yes I fucked my trans because I upped line pressure and put to much power to the trans but it was the HEAT that cause the trans to be fucked up in the first place. Therefore upping the line pressure to try and remedy a fucked up transmission would never be a good thing however if the trans is in good working order and is tuned properly then upping line pressure is a good thing.

  13. #33
    Slower Than a 3rd Gen juiced99ws6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hot Black Trans-Am View Post
    Then why have all the auto's I raced always lost?
    maybe you have a strong running car? I could say the same about all the manuals I have raced however im not stock

  14. #34
    Junior Member 99hoss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by juiced99ws6 View Post
    maybe you have a strong running car? I could say the same about all the manuals I have raced however im not stock

  15. #35
    Junior Member 99hoss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hot Black Trans-Am View Post
    Then why have all the auto's I raced always lost?
    probably your one of the few that can actually drive a manuel not to many guys can . smoking tires from the start line, missed shifts,slow shifting and not using the clutch properly this is very common in what i see all the time

  16. #36
    car enthusiast djvaly's Avatar
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    8 out of 10 M6 cars I have raced lost to my stock A4...
    pretty close mods on both ends most of the times.

  17. #37
    Junior Member 99hoss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djvaly View Post
    8 out of 10 M6 cars I have raced lost to my stock A4...
    pretty close mods on both ends most of the times.
    true that it happens alot to M6 drivers

  18. #38
    The Bandit Wesman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djvaly View Post
    8 out of 10 M6 cars I have raced lost to my stock A4...
    pretty close mods on both ends most of the times.
    Sounds like you need to find some M6 drivers that can actually drive

  19. #39
    car enthusiast djvaly's Avatar
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    M6 theoretically is good, but in practice when in a race all hyper and stuff many drivers messa up, all I gotto worry about 2 hands on the wheel and press the metal to the floor, I really get a kick outta of it when they admit they lost not shifting right and stuff.

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    Slower Than a 3rd Gen juiced99ws6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djvaly View Post
    M6 theoretically is good, but in practice when in a race all hyper and stuff many drivers messa up, all I gotto worry about 2 hands on the wheel and press the metal to the floor, I really get a kick outta of it when they admit they lost not shifting right and stuff.
    very very true. my freind can drive his formula very well on the streets when he is playing around by himself and it is a very strong and quick car however when you put him on the track he either roasts his tires like nothing or bogs the thing down and when he does get a great launch he gets so excited he misses a shift. even people that consider themselves awesome m6 drivers tend to fuck up in the same way unless all you ever do is race and it becomes no big deal.

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