Dodge Magnum Wagon Run/Kill ????

**erikzola** · 07-01-2007, 03:57 PM

On a early morning ride today....about 7:00 or so just cruising on 95 minding my own business. I see this Dodge Magnum wagon getting on behind me and the guy really starts to get going. So we're running at about 100 for a while and I wanted to see what the thing really had in it. We got up to 115-120 or so and had to back down for light traffic. In the next clearing we had we ran again up to 115 or so and then it was my exit. I'm not suggesting that I was out for a kill or anything but I'm suprised that those hemi motors can move along like that, let alone a station wagon. For a moment (only a moment) I wasn't sure I was in a Camaro.....

Anyone run against one of these Dodge cars with a hemi recently? This car was low and must have had 20's or 24's on it.

**jrc1122** · 07-01-2007, 04:50 PM

talk about vague,, -- who was ahead at the end of the acceleration contest? were yall side by side, were yall following each other?

details -- details...

My thoughts are RTs are 14 second cars, SRT-8 is closer to the LS1 (due to weight of cars)

**Rikki_SeVeN** · 07-01-2007, 05:46 PM

Raced a couple...they can't hang at all... raced a SRT8 once...they are impresive for being such big fat cows...but they still can't measure up...

but there's always someone that just outdoes everyone... like a 12sec. Waggon HEMI... that is a regular at the track here...

**hutch1999** · 07-01-2007, 06:11 PM

so basically you guys were just driving fast? no real race?

**RJWZ28** · 07-02-2007, 02:13 AM

That is what I got out of it. And he wants to know how they fare in races.

**erikzola** · 07-02-2007, 04:20 AM

Alright sorry for the confusion. Had to jump off line last night. Yeah we were both running close with eachother. Even with the light traffic we didn't get to run side by side. It was more like who could stay behind the other car. It's not like we were at the track or anything. I guess all I was getting at is that I didn't expect a car like that to be able to keep up as well as it did.

**jrc1122** · 07-02-2007, 06:19 AM

Originally Posted by erikzola

Alright sorry for the confusion. Had to jump off line last night. Yeah we were both running close with eachother. Even with the light traffic we didn't get to run side by side. It was more like who could stay behind the other car. It's not like we were at the track or anything. I guess all I was getting at is that I didn't expect a car like that to be able to keep up as well as it did.

Oh I see

**blackwidow99** · 07-02-2007, 06:28 AM

They run very well but there stock cpu settings tie up a lot of their torque. A good tune will unlock gobs of power.

**patricksd** · 07-04-2007, 04:21 PM

Originally Posted by blackwidow99

They run very well but there stock cpu settings tie up a lot of their torque. A good tune will unlock gobs of power.

They don't have custom tunes available. The closest thing to a custom tune they can achieve is an SMT-6 or a "B&G flash" but it in no way allows for the degree of tunability offered by LS1Edit or HPtuners.

This is the main reason I bought this Camaro - for the tunability and aftermarket support.

**blackwidow99** · 07-05-2007, 07:27 AM

Originally Posted by patricksd

They don't have custom tunes available. The closest thing to a custom tune they can achieve is an SMT-6 or a "B&G flash" but it in no way allows for the degree of tunability offered by LS1Edit or HPtuners.

This is the main reason I bought this Camaro - for the tunability and aftermarket support.

Absolutely true, their aftermarket is very very small right now. The B&G Flash is what I was referring to which eliminates the slow throttle response by allowing you to completely turn off torque management.

Given the 10 years the LS1 has had, I am sure the mods and tunes available will be much more extensive.

**Street Lethal** · 07-05-2007, 07:39 AM

Originally Posted by blackwidow99

Given the 10 years the LS1 has had, I am sure the mods and tunes available will be much more extensive....

Modding has stayed relatively the same for years. Opening up the intake (including throttle body, intake, and heads), while uncorking the exhaust (heads, exhaust), combined with the proper gearing and weight. Nothing's changed, other than PCM tuning, which didn't take the LS1 guys ten years to perfect....

**blackwidow99** · 07-05-2007, 09:28 AM

Originally Posted by Street Lethal

Modding has stayed relatively the same for years. Opening up the intake (including throttle body, intake, and heads), while uncorking the exhaust (heads, exhaust), combined with the proper gearing and weight.

I refer of course to the variety of options that will undoubtedly be made available to this crowd once more vendors jump on board, and begin producing mods that are specifically designed for said vehicle.

**Street Lethal** · 07-05-2007, 10:59 AM

Originally Posted by blackwidow99

I refer of course to the variety of options that will undoubtedly be made available to this crowd once more vendors jump on board, and begin producing mods that are specifically designed for said vehicle....

I know what you are referring to, but waiting for such vendor's, for said vehicle, doesn't have any real relevance with the point that I was trying to make. GM EFI tuning was forced open due mainly to the DIY mailing lists throughout the 90's. Suddenly, a market developed. They did not wait for such vendor's to come about, in fact, real DIY tuners are completely against such opportunism. Said vehicles have had more than enough time for a collective group to enhance the stock PCM's VE tables. As said, LS1'ers did not need an aftermarket, as they've been running fast since the day of it's advent....

**Street Lethal** · 07-05-2007, 11:18 AM

Originally Posted by blackwidow99

Absolutely true, their aftermarket is very very small right now. The B&G Flash is what I was referring to which eliminates the slow throttle response by allowing you to completely turn off torque management....

Incidently, you are aware that the MegaSquirt, which happens to be the best, and the cheapest, stand alone, or integrated EFI unit is fully compatible with said vehicle....?

**blackwidow99** · 07-05-2007, 12:04 PM

Originally Posted by Street Lethal

Suddenly, a market developed.

As it undoubtedly will for said car.

My last post was in reference to various types of modifications, not strictly tuning or any singular EFI unit that may or may not be the "best and cheapest".

It is common knowledge that the LS1 crowd made significant gains with the modifications you mentioned, but comparing the two types of cars is irrelevant. My point was simply stated to inform you that in time, the available options for said crowd to modify said car would improve.

**Street Lethal** · 07-05-2007, 01:08 PM

Originally Posted by blackwidow99

My point was simply stated to inform you that in time, the available options for said crowd to modify said car would improve...

You've again missed the already said point. MegaSquirt has been controlling electronic fuel injection for said engines, for quite the "said" time. Now, whether the enthusiast's actually take the next step and install it, is clearly up to them, but to imply that the aftermarket is not "there" for these engines is wrong. Stock heads can be worked. Stock intake manifolds, throttle bodies can be ported. Heck, stock camshafts can be re-ground. I see these car's running very impressive numbers at the track each and every weekend, in fact, there are a few of them that I honestly passed on running against. No magic, it's ingenuity....

**blackwidow99** · 07-05-2007, 01:53 PM

Originally Posted by blackwidow99

Absolutely true, their aftermarket is very very small right now. The B&G Flash is what I was referring to which eliminates the slow throttle response by allowing you to completely turn off torque management.

Given the 10 years the LS1 has had, I am sure the mods and tunes available will be much more extensive.

I apologize I assumed you were speaking to my point which was originally posted.

Originally Posted by Street Lethal

Stock heads can be worked. Stock intake manifolds, throttle bodies can be ported. Heck, stock camshafts can be re-ground.

The implication that the aftermarket for these vehicles is non-existent was simply never stated. My point was simple, although apparently easy to miss. The aftermarket for these vehicles and the types of tunes available to them will continue to grow the longer they are around. It's comes down to basic supply and demand. As the demand for aftermarket parts grows, so will the supply.

**patricksd** · 07-05-2007, 02:23 PM

I'm not trying to jump into an argument or anything, but I spent the last 3 years in the Hemi camp. Hemi owners are just as rabid at LS1/LS2/LS6 owners. They love performance and there are some talented Mopar guys out there.

The problem is, they receive little to no support from Dodge. Let me give you an example. One of the most popular cams for a 5.7 Hemi is to drop a 6.1 Hemi cam into it. Its adds about 25 rwhp up top. Its popular because it requires no tuning and is relatively cheap. Well, Dodge caught onto this and placed the cam on national restriction. Meaning, the ONLY way you could get one was to prove you had an SRT-8 6.1 Hemi and suffered damage to the motor.

Instead, Dodge "created" a 5.7L Hemi Performance Cam that cost double the price of the 6.1. Capitalism at its best.

When the manufacturer doesn't support the aftermarket - Dodge hasn't supported it since the muscle car era - its difficult to modify a car or truck like you can a Chevy or Ford.