79 Firebird w/ 400 vs Me (02 WS6)

[jrc1122]

I raced my buddy's car. It is a 79 Firebird. Before the race we each rode shotgun in each others car, to get a feel for each others car. Before the race, we both had doubts which car was faster.

His Mods (his description of the car on his myspace)79 firebird.. It has a Pontiac 400 engine with Hedman long tube headers, Edelbrock Performer RPM Intake manifold, Edelbrock RPM 750 carb, 8.8mm Spark plug wires, Mallory HEI Distributor, Dual magnaflow custom exhaust, KYB air adjust shocks front and rear, Addco rear sway bar, Turbo 350 trans with shift kit, B&M Quick Silver ratchet shifter, Posi rear end with 3.73 gears.

My car: 2002 WS6 M6 w/ Magnaflow Cat back, SLP/ with K&N, Pro 5.0 shifter w/ Lou's short stick.

We raced from a dig to 100 mph.

We both launched horrible ( I spun all the way through first, and some of second gear) DUMB!- I still pulled a half car by middle of 2nd gear, by end of third I was about 1.5 cars a head, and pulling further.


Fun times...

[hutch1999]

damn sounds like the old car ran pretty good. are you sure thats all the mods he has? I would guess there was some internal motor work done.

[jrc1122]

damn sounds like the old car ran pretty good. are you sure thats all the mods he has? I would guess there was some internal motor work done.

I don't know-- like I said I pulled that info off his Myspace. He is a young guy 23 i think. He is a certified mechanic, but he didn't do the work to this car, He actually bought it this way, (for the most part) - He hasn't had it that long.

It did run good-- and remember I spun like a mad man-- I've spun that bad at the track before and busted out a 14.3 -- so I would say my horrible run was good for a 14 second pass that time.

But to his defense -- He too spun pretty bad.

Weather permitting we are both going to the track on Wed.

[big hammer]

damn sounds like the old car ran pretty good. are you sure thats all the mods he has? I would guess there was some internal motor work done.

i'd say so too. it wouldnt have hung in that well otherwise.

[hutch1999]

I don't know-- like I said I pulled that info off his Myspace. He is a young guy 23 i think. He is a certified mechanic, but he didn't do the work to this car, He actually bought it this way, (for the most part) - He hasn't had it that long.

It did run good-- and remember I spun like a mad man-- I've spun that bad at the track before and busted out a 14.3 -- so I would say my horrible run was good for a 14 second pass that time.

But to his defense -- He too spun pretty bad.

Weather permitting we are both going to the track on Wed.

good luck at the track

[Firebirdjones]

i'd say so too. it wouldnt have hung in that well otherwise.

Really??? common give those old 400 pontiacs some credit,,,,,I used to compete in factory stock muscle car drags with my 70 formula meaning it has to fit the strict rules to sum up in one sentence,,,,nothing allowed other than what the factory installed on or in the car,,,,,and it runs 13.60's at 102 mph and thats on 6 inch wide biasply tires
It's quick enough to hang with just about any stock or near stock LS1 or LT1 car.


Granted his 79 probably has had a motor swap and tinkered with since you didn't mention if this was a factory 79 smog motor 400.

In any event, sounds cool. Nice to hear of a young gun appreciating some old stuff. Have some fun.

[2-bowties&abird]

what does that older firebird weigh? i would have thought pretty heavy.

[GULLETT17]

what does that older firebird weigh? i would have thought pretty heavy.

i think they are close to 4000 lbs.

[Firebirdjones]

what does that older firebird weigh? i would have thought pretty heavy.

My particular 70 Formula weighs 3,690 lbs. (full tank of gas) without me in it. A race weight of 3,890 lbs. with me in it.

It is exactly 70 lbs. heavier than my 02 SS convertable and exactly 140 lbs. heavier than my wifes 97 Z28 convertable.

And I have seen other 4th gens on the scale heavier than my 4th gens,,some of them were T-top cars even.

So my 70 bird is very comparable in weight to the 4th gens.

[GULLETT17]

My particular 70 Formula weighs 3,690 lbs. (full tank of gas) without me in it. A race weight of 3,890 lbs. with me in it.

It is exactly 70 lbs. heavier than my 02 SS convertable and exactly 140 lbs. heavier than my wifes 97 Z28 convertable.

And I have seen other 4th gens on the scale heavier than my 4th gens,,some of them were T-top cars even.

So my 70 bird is very comparable in weight to the 4th gens.

really?? lighter than i thought!!

[big hammer]

Really??? common give those old 400 pontiacs some credit,,,,,I used to compete in factory stock muscle car drags with my 70 formula meaning it has to fit the strict rules to sum up in one sentence,,,,nothing allowed other than what the factory installed on or in the car,,,,,and it runs 13.60's at 102 mph and thats on 6 inch wide biasply tires
It's quick enough to hang with just about any stock or near stock LS1 or LT1 car.


Granted his 79 probably has had a motor swap and tinkered with since you didn't mention if this was a factory 79 smog motor 400.

In any event, sounds cool. Nice to hear of a young gun appreciating some old stuff. Have some fun.

a 1970 400 is a totally different ballgame compared to the 79. and didnt the 79 come with a 403 olds?

[GULLETT17]

a 1970 400 is a totally different ballgame compared to the 79. and didnt the 79 come with a 403 olds?

very possible its not the original engine . . . 79 had the olds and pontiac available.

[Firebirdjones]

a 1970 400 is a totally different ballgame compared to the 79. and didnt the 79 come with a 403 olds?

You are correct,,,but,,,,,it was not mentioned which 400 was in this firebird,,,whether is was a TA or a Formula,,,or just a plain bird with a transplanted engine,,,,in which case it could be anything.

So it was somewhat of a general comment referring to Big Hammers comment.

You could still get the pontiac 400 engine in 79,,,was the last year. It was the California cars that had the 403 as the only available engine.

[Firebirdjones]

very possible its not the original engine . . . 79 had the olds and pontiac available.

Oooops, I just noticed you posted this. You are correct sir.

[Firebirdjones]

really?? lighter than i thought!!

Well there are probably other second gens that are heavier than mine.

My particular Formula is optioned with power steering and brakes but not much else that adds weight.

I'm sure if you start piling on A/C, power windows/locks and cruise you could easily tip 4,000 lbs. without a driver.

They weren't too bad really when it comes to weight though,,,remember these cars only have a subframe and are mainly of unibody design.

Compared to my chevelle which is a full frame car that has optional A/C and a boat anchor for a motor (454),,,,it comes in at 3,940 lbs. with a full tank of gas. With me in it the car is over 4,100 lbs. race weight,,,,it needs to go on a diet

[GULLETT17]

I see . . . i was thinkin the sticker on the door of my 80 ta said around 4000. . . my formula dont have any those options on it anymore accept power windows so she prob ways lil less what was claimed on the door.

[Firebirdjones]

I see . . . i was thinkin the sticker on the door of my 80 ta said around 4000. . . my formula dont have any those options on it anymore accept power windows so she prob ways lil less what was claimed on the door.

Ya what you are thinking on your 80 may be true,,,,,since the second gens gained some weight in the mid 70's when they implemented side impact doors with more bracing,,,,and 5 mph bumpers front and rear,,,,so the mid to late 70's birds (and camaros) gained some weight.

Not to mention these later years also tend to be loaded with more weight adding options too as America started getting soft and wanted more creature comforts

[jrc1122]

I'm meeting up with him and heading to the track- I will get some more info on his car for you guys.

[jrc1122]

Here is the shitastic track story for the other night!! -- 50 degrees- maybe dropped just below 50 - Cold tires & Cold track = NO traction.

Lowered tire pressure down to 20 PSI.

Got 7 or 8 runs in-- (only one against him)-- I won-- He ran a 14.00 I ran a 13.90 -- KILL ME!!

I was doing okay in first, bogging a bit (crappy 60ft times), - but 2nd gear I spun all the way through the gear?
My 1/8th mile never got into the 8s??

What the heck?? A near stock car on a prepped track spinning the entire second gear on a "prepped" track?

How come when I'm on the damn highway or streets do I never have this problem.


PS my fastest was a shitty 13.8 run @ 103
his fastest was 13.9 @98/99?

[hutch1999]

at least you beat him. no vid?