p1361

**Chad97SS** · 06-03-2008, 07:48 PM

.....

**Chad97SS** · 06-07-2008, 02:01 PM

so what can make an Ignition control module fail a 2nd time. The one I replaced is bad now. And I used the heat sink lubrication and installed it properly.

**5.0THIS** · 06-08-2008, 01:59 AM

Originally Posted by Chad97SS

so what can make an Ignition control module fail a 2nd time. The one I replaced is bad now. And I used the heat sink lubrication and installed it properly.

The signal/ power inputs going into the module. I know that is somewhat broad, but something going to the module is what must be frying it, or some other outside influence inside the engine bay (excess heat, moisture, etc)

**Chad97SS** · 06-08-2008, 05:05 AM

Actually that's not too "broad" at all. If you have a haynes book look at page 12-27 at the top right page. There is a triangle with a B in it that says "To distributor" which is on page 12-25 with a B and a triangle. That line is taken directly off the high side of the coil, ("right side of the coil" in the book). And also notice that the high side is connected to the ICM via that dark gree wire, and that is illustrated by the solid dot. A solid dot on a wiring schematic means they are connected. So, this is what i think is happening. When I had the opti replaced several months ago, they wanted to replace the wires because they had high resistance. But I said no. (these are factory wires from 1997) So it is my guess that the wires are getting more resistive this summer and not passing as much current as they should. So, if the coil is working properly and continues to build up current and voltage for "HEI" and all the current cannot be passed to the plugs because of resistive wires, then the remaining current is shunt through the ICM to ground. And thereby popping the ICM.

Its a very plausible theory because as long as the coil continues to build current and voltage, it has to go somewhere. Coil's work like an inductor. And that is by induction and the number of windings in the coil determines how much of an increase of voltage comes out of it. So as long is it stays working as it should, and if the wires become resistive, then the current, which always takes the path of least resistance, will be shunt through the ICM. Kabang!

**Chad97SS** · 06-18-2008, 07:04 PM

well, I replaced it and then it lasted a week.. but all I am doing is driving about 15minutes to work up and down the tollway.. But today I drove for about 30 minutes and idled thru downtown and it started missing and choaking and the check engine light came on (P1361 again) then by the time I got home it died. I started it back up again and pulled into the garage and it died again.

Its like if I drive for 30 minutes in idle traffic, the ICM is getting too hot and it zaps it.
But I know those ICMs get hot just by normal orperation. So, maybe if it gets too much current thru it, it really tests it and kills it.

I started it back up tonight, and it idles just fine, but if I take it out for a drive it might start chaoking and coughing and missing again. So I think temperature has something to do with it.

I replaced 4 wires but not the other 5. (including the coil wire)

So its either a short, or the other plug wires, or the coil or the ECM that is fouling the ICM. It can't be anything else because that is all that is connected to the ICM. And my engine runs about 185 with the A/C on. So, it should not be getting too hot. Although, 10 or 15 degrees may not matter too much if its already sumemr time and hot outside.

So I don't knwo what to do with it. Replace everything? shesh. Fortunately, I have a boss that will let me work from home from time to time.

**Chad97SS** · 06-18-2008, 08:09 PM

maybe I should follow this tomorrow

http://www.hotrodlane.cc/New%20LS%20...TC%20P1361.htm

**Chad97SS** · 06-19-2008, 11:45 AM

well I follow that guide, and it lead me back to the ICM.

SO I replaced the ICM once again, and cleared the codes, and this time I got a P1351. Which is a high voltage condition. Which is what I suspected all along. I have too much current and heat is popping the ICM. Now, where is it coming from. haha Coil? Where else could it possibly come from..

**Chad97SS** · 06-23-2008, 11:49 AM

I just took the car into Sewell GMC/Buick today. I don't want to get stuck guessing at what is causing the ICM to blow.

They also informed me of a recall on a smog device. I said, Oh I alreayd had that installed. And he said, no this is something else. He had a record of what was installed in 2000 but this was a different component.

I also asked him to fix the air bag light. Finding a mechanic that works on air bags is nearly as impossible as finding an airbag troubleshoooting guide for a camaro on the internet.

**Chad97SS** · 06-27-2008, 09:39 AM

Even SEWELL GMC/BUICK in Dallas does not know what is wrong with it. They replaced the ICM and still trouble exists. So they said we can start replacing the spark plug wires.. but I said I can arbitrarily replace parts.. SO I told them to put it back the way it was and I will work on it myself. They simply dont know what's wrong with it. I am going to work on it this weekend.. with my cobalt rental car.. haha

**Chad97SS** · 07-08-2008, 07:28 PM

Well, 4th of July weekend, I had an extra day off, so I started replacing the sparkplug wires on the passenger side.. So Friday from 11am - 3pm I replaced the passenger side plug wires. Yup!.. 4 plug wires, 4 hours + 2 bruises + 10 cuts and a Drenched shirt and 1/2 Drenched jean shorts. So, now, I am going to replace the ignition coil for $60 and the ICM one more time. And give it a shot. That is the entire ignition system! (Besides the ecm) and the optispark was replaced in the past year.

IN the meantime, This weekend I bought a Black and Tan 2005 Acura TL for $22,700 w/ navigation, hands free bluetooth for cell phone, XM radio with a small subwoofer, power sunroof, voice recogition on the cell phone and navi, free factorty warranty up to 50k miles, and new tires.. It has 35k miles, and I got 4.5% interest and I put down $6,000 in cash. And I still have my Camaro. YUP!! Ain't letting it go that easy ..

So anyways.. the hard part is done with the Camaro.. Soon, I'll be adding headers when I get this ignition problem fixed that Sewell of Dallas could not fix.

**95Firebirdred** · 07-16-2008, 12:54 PM

when the car gets hot does it start to be a lil sluggest?

**Chad97SS** · 07-16-2008, 01:03 PM

at first it's slightly sluggish, then I turn around and go straight home, and by the time I get home, it won't hardly accellerate as it becomes Extremely sluggish, then by the time I get to my apartment, its coughs and spits and missfires and it dies in the parking spot.

But I am ordering a few new parts and should be in the mail soon. Sewell of Dallas, not only could not figure out what was wrong with my car, but when they re-installed the ICM, they stripped out the threads on the bracket that the ICM and heat sink are screw onto. So, the ICM was not tight enough. That is a problem because it must be firmly installed to have the heat dissipated through the heat sink. Plus they didnt re-install my air breather properly.. They really screwed me. I had a rental car the whole week and the bracket is discontinued from the dealers.

**95Firebirdred** · 07-17-2008, 01:09 PM

I don't trust dealerships to work on my car. My car is doing almost the same right now. I took my coil and icm to autozone and they tested it. It came back fine. On your car i am wondering if your coil is bad and is not doing anything until it gets hot. I asked my dad about this and he was telling me that the coil was going but it was not all the way gone yet and it was causing the icm to fail. I am not sure though.

**Chad97SS** · 07-17-2008, 01:17 PM

That is a very strong possibility. So I ordered a used one from Ebay. I tried getting that mounting bracket from the dealer, but it is actually discontinued. amazing. So the thing I ordered on ebay is the coil and the bracket and another ICM. It came altogether. I mainly need the bracket. But it was cheap for it all.

But yes, something is definately getting hot and then buzzing the ICM. But I want to add that old wires and become excessively resistive when they get hot too. So that could be in a way, choaking the current flow from going through to the spark plugs. And since current takes the path of least resistance, I think it is possible that when the coil builds up the charge, instead of being shunt through to the plugs, it's going through the ICM to ground. Its hard to say completely .. The schematics in the Haynes book are good but they are not as detailed as what I would like.

So what codes are you getting?

I also just replaced the passenger side spark plug wires last weekend. It was a total pain! I had to remove the alernator and the PS pump. I did the front three cylinders on the drivers side about 2 weeks ago. That was also a pain. I have not yet figured out how to get the last cylinder done. #7 I may have to remove the exhaust manifold. And to do that, I MAY have to disconnect the Y pipe on both sides and May have to drop the front side of the exhaust. haha

2 years ago, when I had the heads off because of the blown head gasket, me and a guy from this forum had the exhaust down, just like I described. He also suggested that I replaced the plug wires at that time. I so should have listened to him.

**95Firebirdred** · 07-17-2008, 10:10 PM

low resolution pluse code 16 i took my plugs out gaped them and put them back in two hours without taking anything off it was a pain in the ass. the easiest way to get to that plug is from the bottom between the two pipes .my my check engine light is not on havent drove car yet though. i an going to this weekend

**Chad97SS** · 07-18-2008, 05:41 AM

How do you know "low resolution pluse code 16" without having any codes? haha

anyway, from a google search I did, supposedly the low res pulse code comes from the Optispark and has something to so with the crank sensor too.

**95Firebirdred** · 07-18-2008, 04:21 PM

thats what a shop told me. They scanned it and thats what there scanner said. I drove the car today and check engine light came on. so now i am going to ge a temp sensor.

**95Firebirdred** · 07-19-2008, 06:17 AM

temp sensor didn't fix mine. I am going to order a new distributor. When you going to have your parts

**Chad97SS** · 07-21-2008, 01:35 PM

I should have my coil and ICM (used) by 7/22 or 7/23. And I just replaced all the spark plug wires except for #7 and got a new optispark distributor about 9 months ago. So I am working on nearly a completely new ignition system. I just have to figure out how to get that #7 spark plug wire. Its routed and wrapped up against the engine behind some heat shielding which is behind the exhaust manifold. crazy.

But I wouldnt think a temp sensor would fix it anyway. Is that part of the ignition system? And if you distributor is broke, then it will misfire when its cold too. But if there is a cam sensor that comes with the distr, then I dont know anythign about that.

**Chad97SS** · 09-17-2008, 03:26 PM

well it took me a while, but I got the new Wires and PLugs installed. and its running much better. In fact i have not had the check engine light come on since I changed the wires and and plugs. And i've driven it twice for about 20 to 30 minutes each. PLus someone test drove my car and still no check engine light, but they did notice the misfire but it is/was only at a high RPM. I say "was" because after moved the ICM off the Engine head, it's not even missing at all now. Now, grant it, I ran the car for only about 20 minutes and it was not real hot outside, but it did get up to normal operating tempurature for at least 20 min. I did this mod after the plugs and wires. And last night, I did not notice even a slight misfire. With the old plugs and wires, even though it was not acting up, I could tell it still had a slight stumble and a stutter and random times, even when it was very cool, but only when I gave it the gas fairly hard. But now, its not even doing it a little bit. So the next test will be when i test it under a heavy load at 210 degrees and hot outside. If it does ok then, then I should be good.

But even still, lies the question, "why did I have to move the icm off the engine head? It may be the order inwhich I replaced my components and the fact that the wires and plugs may have been the culprit in combination with the coil getting old. Then that was possibly causing the ICM to foul out. The coil and ICM replacement parts are from orielly. I could get both a/c delco from gmparts direct .com. and then remount them back down on the engine head and that might be ok and not cause any problems if the ac delco parts have some sort of high heat tolerance and the orielly parts do not.. Just a guess.. but if the ac delco parts are not any higher heat handling than orielly parts then I would be wasting my money to buy ac delco and then it might foul out the gm icm and coil too. So maybe its better off leaving well enough alone. haha (just still trying to nail down the cause of the failure and still i ahve more testing to do.) NO other mechanic wanted to touch it! And Sewell GMC in Dallas couldn't figure it out.

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