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what's the difference?

This is a discussion on what's the difference? within the Firebird / WS6 forums, part of the Vehicle Specific category; Originally Posted by 9T8W66 $3150 worth of factory parts that most people replace anyway (except maybe the Hood) LS1 is ...

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by 9T8W66 View Post
    $3150 worth of factory parts that most people replace anyway (except maybe the Hood)



    LS1 is an LS1 is an LS1, There is NO difference all LS1's (regardless of year) make 345-350 HP no matter what chassis they were installed in.
    This just needs to be on the banner of this site. ls1 = 350hp /

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    Senior Member Too Fast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9T8W66 View Post
    $3150 worth of factory parts that most people replace anyway (except maybe the Hood)



    LS1 is an LS1 is an LS1, There is NO difference all LS1's (regardless of year) make 345-350 HP no matter what chassis they were installed in.


    "Except maybe the hood" and the raised airbox to better line up the airflow. And the airbox is discontinued now.....

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    [ there were no different internal engine parts.



    98-00 Had a different cam

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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTY JERZY View Post
    [ there were no different internal engine parts.



    98-00 Had a different cam
    Yes but he meant between base T/A and ws6. not 98-00 and 01-02

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    Quote Originally Posted by 9T8W66 View Post
    LS1 is an LS1 is an LS1, There is NO difference all LS1's (regardless of year) make 345-350 HP no matter what chassis they were installed in.
    The engine is the same, sure. But it's not just on a different chassis. It has better air intake and exhaust. And easier air flow in and out certainly does change the HP to the wheels. Otherwise, why the hell do we all do lid and catbacks/exhaust as our first mods?? We're not just a bunch of lemmings...
    Last edited by Schmalgar; 04-14-2010 at 12:23 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Schmalgar View Post
    The engine is the same, sure. But it's not just on a different chassis. It has better air intake and exhaust. And easier air flow in and out certainly does change the HP to the wheels. Otherwise, why the hell do we all do lid and catbacks/exhaust as our first mods?? We're not just a bunch of lemmings...
    Yes but even guys with ws6s and SSs upgrade intake and exhaust because even the stock ws6/SS exhaust still has to pass inspection and is still quite restrictive. A m6 base T/A vs m6 ws6 is a drivers race, plain and simple.

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    Senior Member Schmalgar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zinergy View Post
    Yes but even guys with ws6s and SSs upgrade intake and exhaust because even the stock ws6/SS exhaust still has to pass inspection and is still quite restrictive. A m6 base T/A vs m6 ws6 is a drivers race, plain and simple.
    That I certainly agree with... Just speaking to the principle of the engine as an air pump...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Schmalgar View Post
    The engine is the same, sure. But it's not just on a different chassis. It has better air intake and exhaust. And easier air flow in and out certainly does change the HP to the wheels. Otherwise, why the hell do we all do lid and catbacks/exhaust as our first mods?? We're not just a bunch of lemmings...
    Guess I have to post the oldest known dyno comparison between an F-body and a Vette Done by Hot Rod Magazine back in the spring of `98
    If this doesn't convince anyone that their all the same I don't know what will.



    BTW the different cam specs between `98-`00 F-bodies and Vettes is negligable. Also the `01-04 engines use a less aggressive 6.0 truck cam to offset the updated (LS6) intake manifold.
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    Ok. So the different exhausts, intakes, cams, timings, whatever the hell else is different per car, means absolutely nothing? There is 0 power difference on any car to ever have had an LS1 in it? Yes of course they are the same block. But NONE of the peripherals have ANY effect on the power output?

    -----

    PS, the question is not sarcasm. I know of course that all these models have LS1s in them. But I am truly asking if the vastly different peripheral configurations between f-bodies, Corvettes, Cadillacs, G8s, and whatever else has an LS1, have ZERO impact. I just don't see how that's possible...
    Last edited by Schmalgar; 04-14-2010 at 04:22 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Schmalgar View Post
    Ok. So the different exhausts, intakes, cams, timings, whatever the hell else is different per car, means absolutely nothing? There is 0 power difference on any car to ever have had an LS1 in it? Yes of course they are the same block. But NONE of the peripherals have ANY effect on the power output?

    -----

    PS, the question is not sarcasm. I know of course that all these models have LS1s in them. But I am truly asking if the vastly different peripheral configurations between f-bodies, Corvettes, Cadillacs, G8s, and whatever else has an LS1, have ZERO impact. I just don't see how that's possible...
    G8's i know didnt, and i dont think any caddys had LS1s,


    yes, all LS1's are created equal. believe it

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    Senior Member Too Fast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schmalgar View Post
    Ok. So the different exhausts, intakes, cams, timings, whatever the hell else is different per car, means absolutely nothing? There is 0 power difference on any car to ever have had an LS1 in it? Yes of course they are the same block. But NONE of the peripherals have ANY effect on the power output?

    -----

    PS, the question is not sarcasm. I know of course that all these models have LS1s in them. But I am truly asking if the vastly different peripheral configurations between f-bodies, Corvettes, Cadillacs, G8s, and whatever else has an LS1, have ZERO impact. I just don't see how that's possible...
    And you would be right. Different exhausts, intake configurations do change things a bit, but the basic engine was all the same. Did the LS1 'vettes have different cam/heads then the F-body? Anyone?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Too Fast View Post
    And you would be right. Different exhausts, intake configurations do change things a bit, but the basic engine was all the same. Did the LS1 'vettes have different cam/heads then the F-body? Anyone?
    No they didnt have different cams or heads, but then again he never said they did.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by 9T8W66 View Post
    Guess I have to post the oldest known dyno comparison between an F-body and a Vette Done by Hot Rod Magazine back in the spring of `98
    If this doesn't convince anyone that their all the same I don't know what will.

    Click for full size

    BTW the different cam specs between `98-`00 F-bodies and Vettes is negligable. Also the `01-04 engines use a less aggressive 6.0 truck cam to offset the updated (LS6) intake manifold.
    Quick question. In this article they said the 345hp vette should put 320 to the road? Wouldnt that be 380ish at the engine?

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    Yes the ls1 puts almost 350 to the wheels

    scoggin dickies ran a ls1 crate motor with vette manifolds and it spit out 402 at the crank

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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTY JERZY View Post
    Yes the ls1 puts almost 350 to the wheels

    scoggin dickies ran a ls1 crate motor with vette manifolds and it spit out 402 at the crank
    I have to ask - Who is Scoggin Dickies?

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    a performance company

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    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    I have to ask - Who is Scoggin Dickies?
    funny name. serious performance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTY JERZY View Post
    Yes the ls1 puts almost 350 to the wheels

    scoggin dickies ran a ls1 crate motor with vette manifolds and it spit out 402 at the crank
    Are the LS1 crate engines you can buy today significantly different from our cars?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Schmalgar View Post
    Ok. So the different exhausts, intakes, cams, timings, whatever the hell else is different per car, means absolutely nothing? There is 0 power difference on any car to ever have had an LS1 in it? Yes of course they are the same block. But NONE of the peripherals have ANY effect on the power output?

    -----

    PS, the question is not sarcasm. I know of course that all these models have LS1s in them. But I am truly asking if the vastly different peripheral configurations between f-bodies, Corvettes, Cadillacs, G8s, and whatever else has an LS1, have ZERO impact. I just don't see how that's possible...
    For one yor talking about some cars with different engines.
    LS1 engine was built between `97-`04 installed in Vettes, F-bodies and GTO's
    Early Cadillac CTSV's have LS6's (405 HP)for a couple years then moved up to the LS2 (400 HP) before going to the LSA (556 HP 6.2 S/C) in the new car.
    G8's use the L76 (361 HP) which is basically an LS2 (6.0) shortblock with LS3 heads and intake and a much smaller cam. The GXP model runs the Vettes LS3 engine (430 HP) which is the same as M6 equipped 2010 Camaro's.

    Quote Originally Posted by Too Fast View Post
    And you would be right. Different exhausts, intake configurations do change things a bit, but the basic engine was all the same. Did the LS1 'vettes have different cam/heads then the F-body? Anyone?
    Cam specs `97-99 Corvettes
    199/207 .472/.479 117 LSA
    Cam specs `98-00 F-body
    198/209 .500/.500 119 LSA
    Corvette 2000 (used to offset the addition of 2 extra pup convertors)
    198/209 .500/.500 115.5 LSA
    LS1 Cam `2001-2004 All models
    196/207 .467/.479 116 LSA

    All LS1 heads are virtually the same.

    As you can see the differences in Cams in marginal in fact the most aggressive cam was the 2000 Vette which used an F-body spec cam but with a tighter LSA because Corvettes never had EGR.

    Any more questions ?

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    Senior Member Too Fast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9T8W66 View Post
    For one yor talking about some cars with different engines.
    LS1 engine was built between `97-`04 installed in Vettes, F-bodies and GTO's
    Early Cadillac CTSV's have LS6's (405 HP)for a couple years then moved up to the LS2 (400 HP) before going to the LSA (556 HP 6.2 S/C) in the new car.
    G8's use the L76 (361 HP) which is basically an LS2 (6.0) shortblock with LS3 heads and intake and a much smaller cam. The GXP model runs the Vettes LS3 engine (430 HP) which is the same as M6 equipped 2010 Camaro's.



    Cam specs `97-99 Corvettes
    199/207 .472/.479 117 LSA
    Cam specs `98-00 F-body
    198/209 .500/.500 119 LSA
    Corvette 2000 (used to offset the addition of 2 extra pup convertors)
    198/209 .500/.500 115.5 LSA
    LS1 Cam `2001-2004 All models
    196/207 .467/.479 116 LSA

    All LS1 heads are virtually the same.

    As you can see the differences in Cams in marginal in fact the most aggressive cam was the 2000 Vette which used an F-body spec cam but with a tighter LSA because Corvettes never had EGR.

    Any more questions ?


    Not yet mister smarty pants. LOL, no offense intended, I was hoping you would answer with cam specs.

    Anyway, what a HUGE difference cams are today, with total driveability and smooth idles. Almost any .500 lift cam in the late 60s would be huge, let alone roller valvetrains!

    A ram air IV cam for a 400 Pontiac in 1969 would spec out as .511 lift with a 230* intake 240* exhaust duration, if I remember correct.

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