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ls1 vs STI???

This is a discussion on ls1 vs STI??? within the Firebird / WS6 forums, part of the Vehicle Specific category; Okay, I'll put in my $0.02 because I've seen and joined this discussion many times and I mess with an ...

  1. #61
    Senior Member Redphoenix1998's Avatar
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    Okay, I'll put in my $0.02 because I've seen and joined this discussion many times and I mess with an STi a lot because my best friend drives one. Stock for stock, the LS1 and the STi is a driver's race for sure. I helped my buddy shop for his STi at the time and when deciding between an LS1 and another car, STi wasn't released at the time, we looked for comfort. Yes, the LS1 is comfortable, but can we really haul 4 people comfortably and carry groceries at the same time? Would you want to sit behind the driver of a trans am on a 300 mile trip? I think not! When the STi was released, my buddy and I looked up the specs. Brembo brakes, 4 cyl boxer turbocharged capable of 13 sec quarters, AWD, 4 doors, lots of interior space, trunk, 6 spd, great handling. All for under 35k. It's a deal hard to pass up. Plus with the warranty Subi offers, you definately can't top that kind of a deal. Personally, I would get one myself. I love the look of the 05 and 04's, I am a little iffy about the 06 look. But when it comes to performance and comfort, the WS6 is a drivers car, and the WS6 is made to be an everyday grocery getter designed to run alongside some quick street cars as well. When my buddy got his 05, we played, but I used my other T/A, a bone stock M6 with no mods what so ever. From the line, I got raped, he practiced and after 1 clutch, he learned a good launch technique. But once he learned, we ran and from my viewpont, he was gone before I got traction off the line. About 2nd gear I started to wheel him in and we went throught the 1/4 with the ls1 only about 1/2 a car ahead. Then the modding came, one by one he changed his up pipe, down pipe, installed a cutout, and trust me, it sounds mean as hell. New BOV, HKS intake, and some other mods as well as suspension. Then we ran with my red WS6 which at the time was pushing 435 rwhp. From the line, we were neck in neck but after I hooked up, we were neck in neck till about 4th gear when the WS6 basically said bye bye and scooted off by 3-4 car lengths. Now I have a fully built motor and lots of goodies and push 500 rwhp and he is still aiming at 400 whp. With my setup now, I ran a black STi with 450 whp and it was a good run. I got him by 2 cars but off the line he murdered me. What I learned from my buddy modding his STi, it doesn't take that much money to make it quick just like an LS1, and once the modding starts, these things add HP like no tomorrow. Swap in a bigger turbo, you've got a very quick street legal car that will give any LS1 a nice run for it's money.
    98 WS6 M6 ASC #2647
    Forged Custom 408 w/Vortec YSi

  2. #62
    NY Representative Vertiviper's Avatar
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    yo wasnt there some one from this message board dropping an LS1 into his subi?

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by nhraformula
    what are you talking about.
    A4 LS1s are 13s stock. my car was doing 13.40s totally stock.

    even the m6s were having problems getting 13.3-13.4... with a pro driver...

    are you sure your car was stock? if so, then I probably need to work on my launches... but I doubt my launches affect it .6 seconds... although I'd be glad if that were the case, cuz then I can improve for cheap...

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vertiviper
    yo wasnt there some one from this message board dropping an LS1 into his subi?
    Yeah I remember reading that somewhere - I think on NASIOC. I think he was even doing a RWD conversion. I'm sorry but that's definitely not a Subie any more and the cutting he had to do to the chassis just makes me shudder. I bet it is fast though, especially losing some of the heavy AWD components.
    Last edited by Fiend; 04-09-2006 at 03:37 PM.

  5. #65
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    A question for you guys:

    In stock form, what do LT1s and LS1s typically run in the 1/4? I'm curious because the LS1 I ran at drag strip ran a 13.3 @ 102.15 with a 1.95 60ft. I didn't get a chance to see if he was running drag radials or slicks or if he was stock (I assumed he was.)

  6. #66
    member since may 2000 nhraformula's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScrapMaker
    even the m6s were having problems getting 13.3-13.4... with a pro driver...

    are you sure your car was stock? if so, then I probably need to work on my launches... but I doubt my launches affect it .6 seconds... although I'd be glad if that were the case, cuz then I can improve for cheap...
    i bought the car in 2000, ive been the only owner.
    the track i race at is 41 dragway and is 600 something above sea level.
    a stock auto in chicago has no problems hitting those times.
    btw, six speeds suck for dragracing.
    2000 nhra edition formula
    a few bolt ons, 379 rwhp
    11.96 @113.25

  7. #67
    member since may 2000 nhraformula's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fiend
    A question for you guys:

    In stock form, what do LT1s and LS1s typically run in the 1/4? I'm curious because the LS1 I ran at drag strip ran a 13.3 @ 102.15 with a 1.95 60ft. I didn't get a chance to see if he was running drag radials or slicks or if he was stock (I assumed he was.)
    lt1s are 14 seconds cars.
    as for the ls1, its possible to cut that 1.95 60".
    chances are he had nittos ill bet.
    most stock tire cars are doing 2.0s 60" at best.

  8. #68
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    I got 2.21 60ft with TCS

    3.4 without... smoked for like 100ft

    haha I raced a foxbody GT... he got 16.16

    guess I shouldn't laugh since they can put in about a grand and make a 12-second car...

  9. #69
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    Having owned 3 C5s and an older 5.7 T/A, I have to quote "there's no replacement for displacement". But that's only one aspect of the overall feel of any car. While my 01 C5 was smooth as a Lexus on the highway, it behaved poorly over a 1" bump/RR track in the turns. The STI on the other hand, tracks nicely over worse bumbs and feels really tight.

    While I'm not crazy about the 4drs or compact size of the STI, I couldn't pass on the deal ($27K, 1700 miles, 2 months old 2006).

    The two cars in question on this thread couldn't be more opposite.
    I love the handling and decent power on the STI but it leaves me wanting more HP. I don't like the fact that it's great to 130MPH then has to fight so hard to go any faster. My C5s on the other hand ran hard all the way to 149+ with the top down.

    Will invest in a stage 2 after my warranty expires. Until then, who wants to race in the dirt?
    Last edited by provenuts; 04-22-2006 at 11:48 PM.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by provenuts
    Having owned 3 C5s and an older 5.7 T/A, I have to quote "there's no replacement for displacement".

    ...

    Will invest in a stage 2 after my warranty expires. Until then, who wants to race in the dirt?
    Don't wait for your warranty to expire. Stage 2 won't hurt your engine and it will really even out the power delivery. Get Protuned and you could probably break 300whp/320wtq on the stock turbo. That should put you around mid-12s @ 107-109. Lots of people are running FP green turbos and have no problem with the stock block at 380-400whp. That's usually good for low-low 12s @ ~114.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fiend
    Don't wait for your warranty to expire. Stage 2 won't hurt your engine and it will really even out the power delivery. Get Protuned and you could probably break 300whp/320wtq on the stock turbo. That should put you around mid-12s @ 107-109. Lots of people are running FP green turbos and have no problem with the stock block at 380-400whp. That's usually good for low-low 12s @ ~114.
    my friend has an 05, and took off hit cats, and all new exhaust... that's good for exactly a 13.0 quarter mile...

  12. #72
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    Question

    Thanks for the advise. I heard horror stories with voided warranties for the slightess mods. A guy at work has an 05 that tracked the car over 20 days since new. He got Subi to replace two sets of brakes pads and the front rotors on warranty($4000+). He said they try hard each visit to void his warranty.

    I found the Tanabe G-Blue turbo back for $700, and a used XEDE vishnu for $350. I'm not crazy with the sound on the Tanabe and have been told to go with cobb instead. I figure $1000 is pretty cheap for the additional 70 HP crank horses. Any ideas?

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by provenuts
    Thanks for the advise. I heard horror stories with voided warranties for the slightess mods. A guy at work has an 05 that tracked the car over 20 days since new. He got Subi to replace two sets of brakes pads and the front rotors on warranty($4000+). He said they try hard each visit to void his warranty.

    I found the Tanabe G-Blue turbo back for $700, and a used XEDE vishnu for $350. I'm not crazy with the sound on the Tanabe and have been told to go with cobb instead. I figure $1000 is pretty cheap for the additional 70 HP crank horses. Any ideas?
    <Red Phoenix> Thanks for sharing your stories. You have one mean LS1. I'm always impressed when those cars can make 500rwhp in NA form. I remember a while back I cam across a video of a TT LS1 Camaro and that was one of the greatest sounding cars I've heard in a while(And he smoked the supercharged Cobra!)

    Provenuts, I agree it's easy to get used to the power. I highly recommend the Borla Hush TWIN TIP for sound and looks(Deep and growly). It's a quality American made exhaust(1 million mile warranty) and looks tasteful on the car. I have a Cobb Stage 2 reflash with the basic Stage 2 map and can vouch for it(But still need to get custom tuned).

    Like Fiend just mentioned...Cobb AP with a Pro-tune is a popular proven way to go and once tuned(depending on the dyno) 300awhp/320awtq awaits you. I'm still amazed that the 2.5 engine and stock turbo setup can give you around 400(Crank) ft-lbs of torque! The car is very tractable and easy to drive with even the stock torque ratings. If that isn't enough Fiend gave some good adivce on the FP Green Turbo(My next mod). After much research that turbo offers some really good bank for the buck and overall performance. Good luck.
    Last edited by garrettjj; 04-23-2006 at 08:30 PM.

  14. #74
    Member ErikElvis's Avatar
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    This doesnt have much to do with anything but I never realized how useless Camaro/birds are. u cant do anything but go fast in them. My little eclipse is more useful. But I guess I didnt buy it for practicality. If thats a word.

  15. #75
    Member mavrikZ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ErikElvis
    This doesnt have much to do with anything but I never realized how useless Camaro/birds are. u cant do anything but go fast in them. My little eclipse is more useful. But I guess I didnt buy it for practicality. If thats a word.
    What exactly can you do in an Eclipse that you cant in a F-body?

  16. #76
    The Bandit Wesman's Avatar
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    Interesting thread.

    Stock for stock in the 1/4 mile, an LS1 vs. STI is pretty much a drivers race. The STI would get the launch due to AWD, and then the LS1 would quickly reel it in. So they end up finishing in about the same time, but the LS1 trap speed would be 7-9MPH faster, which is significant. Hence the reason an LS1will walk all over an STI from anything other than a dig.

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by mavrikZ
    What exactly can you do in an Eclipse that you cant in a F-body?
    I can put the back seats down and have the whole hatch area to stuff junk in. U'd be suprised

  18. #78
    The Bandit Wesman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ErikElvis
    I can put the back seats down and have the whole hatch area to stuff junk in. U'd be suprised
    Okay...but I don't think a folding rear seat makes the difference between being "useless" and being "practical"

  19. #79
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    dude!! c'mon... I mean, if your rear seat doesn't allow for extra storage, what kinda of car is it??

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vertiviper
    Hey all,

    A buddy and I are always havin this debate... which car would win:

    99 T/A 6spd (magaflow catback/slp flowpac) non WS6
    vs
    2006 stock WRX STI

    T/A has 305 stock hp, 344 tq

    STI has 300/300 even

    thoughts?????



    he says AWD would beat the T/A off the line by 1.5 car lengths, ..i disagree....i think the decent torque we have WOULD make up for some launch.....

    Don't know where you're located, but here in the thin air, the STI will win off the line and by about .5 seconds at the end of the 1/4, as you describe the two vehicles.

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