Rear end or long tubes?

**km346** · 07-19-2011, 08:54 PM

Mods in sig, what would you guys do next... Buy a set of longtubes and get it dyno tuned or a buy a nice aftermarket rear end? Im really leaning towards the rear, but i donno. Obviously a set of headers and ory would be much cheaper, but im having trouble deciding. If i bought headers i would get something SS... ARH would be my #1 choice but i have heard that texas speed has a set of stainless 1 7/8 headers / Y in the works. If i bought the rear It'd probably be a strange s60. I originally wanted a strange 12 bolt but i would like to avoid the gear whine at all costs. The car is strictly a street car / cruiser. although i do drive it pretty hard. If i chose the rear i would buy some DR's and run it down the 1320 much more often. lets hear some opinions!

**transamtom** · 07-20-2011, 01:18 AM

Lots of guys race their M6's with a stock 10 bolt.

I vote headers because nothing beats adding 20-30 HP and about as much TQ.

Get the rearend when the 10 bolt breaks.

**Too Fast** · 07-20-2011, 02:19 AM

Headers. I still have my 10 bolt, 103k and no issues. I did put on a girdle and welded my axle tubes to the center section about 50k ago. But I am not so brave to run slicks or any street slicks either! I gained 2+ MPH at the 1/4, and 1.5 highway MPG, and dropped .2-.3 ET. That was 9 months after my Hooker LT/ORY install, and no tune. I didn't get my Frost tune until 3.5 years after my header install, finally got rid of the SES light!

**Knight** · 07-20-2011, 03:44 AM

Rear end. It's much better to build the drivetrain to handle the extra horsepower, than to hope the stock stuff can hold up. It's no fun sitting somewhere waiting for a tow, and then having to fix whatever is broken. And a rear diff. usually isn't a cheap fix. Just my opinion though.

**konigandy6** · 07-20-2011, 04:48 AM

Originally Posted by Knight

Rear end. It's much better to build the drivetrain to handle the extra horsepower, than to hope the stock stuff can hold up. It's no fun sitting somewhere waiting for a tow, and then having to fix whatever is broken. And a rear diff. usually isn't a cheap fix. Just my opinion though.

This

I learned this the hard way. If you eventually will be adding power such as a cam or full HCI upgrade or even FI... do the rear first, and a new clutch.

**jfl330** · 07-20-2011, 05:40 AM

I just put all new bearings and seals in my 10 bolt with 113K on it. Sounds like new again, as in quiet, no more screaming bearings. If you do not put sticky tires on it and do not do hard launches from a stop, that 10 bolt will go a while. This is my third gen iv fbody, all 6 speeds, never had a rear end problem. When I bought this car, the bearings wer already shot, great leverage to get the price way down.

I am in similar situation as you, if I can find an exhaust (headers to tail pipes) that I can get to clear speed bumps, that's what I'm putting in. I already rub with the factory exhaust. Car is lowered a little too far, bought it that way.

I drive it almost everyday, I almost never drag race it, give me the everyday power.

Jon

**themanofsteel20** · 07-20-2011, 08:31 AM

Originally Posted by transamtom

Lots of guys race their M6's with a stock 10 bolt.

I vote headers because nothing beats adding 20-30 HP and about as much TQ.

Get the rearend when the 10 bolt breaks.

I agree with this comment 100%. Go with the headers, that is what I am doing next. I am pretty sure I am going to go with the Texas Speed ones you mentioned too.

**transamtom** · 07-20-2011, 02:15 PM

Originally Posted by themanofsteel20

I agree with this comment 100%. Go with the headers, that is what I am doing next. I am pretty sure I am going to go with the Texas Speed ones you mentioned too.

You can pick up 10 bolts dirt cheap,you can also pick up deals on 9" 12 bolts and D60's from guys parting out their cars.

**Too Fast** · 07-20-2011, 02:57 PM

Originally Posted by jfl330

I just put all new bearings and seals in my 10 bolt with 113K on it. Sounds like new again, as in quiet, no more screaming bearings. If you do not put sticky tires on it and do not do hard launches from a stop, that 10 bolt will go a while. This is my third gen iv fbody, all 6 speeds, never had a rear end problem. When I bought this car, the bearings wer already shot, great leverage to get the price way down.

I am in similar situation as you, if I can find an exhaust (headers to tail pipes) that I can get to clear speed bumps, that's what I'm putting in. I already rub with the factory exhaust. Car is lowered a little too far, bought it that way.

I drive it almost everyday, I almost never drag race it, give me the everyday power.

Jon

I gained ground clearance with my Hookers. Their ORY sits higher than the stock Y, but I did have to massage it a bit on the top of driver's side to get the extra clearance. My car isn't lowered, and I can fit a Coke can under the headers, and almost under the ORY.

**35th-ANV-SS** · 07-20-2011, 02:57 PM

My pumpkin started leaking at 12k miles on my 10 bolt....stock power.

As far as gear whine goes...if the gears are set-up properly, you won't have any so don't let what you've read about gear whine influence your decision on which rear end to get.

**Firebirdjones** · 07-20-2011, 03:00 PM

A rearend should be the first upgrade done to any 4th gen before wrenching on anything else. After nearly wrecking a car at the strip on a stock 10bolt, I generally don't care to pound on one anymore without an upgraded rear.

People should always start at the weak link first, and build from there. In the case of the 4th gen, it's the rearend. These 10 bolts are door stops and nothing more. Don't worry about HP. Build the rear now, and do it right the first time, and you won't find yourself crawling under there anymore in the future. Why torture yourself.

**Too Fast** · 07-20-2011, 03:05 PM

^^^BC maybe some people don't have the money for a new ~$3k diff, and may have money for $500-1200 for some nice headers. If you don't abuse the diff, it will last under moderate power increases for a time. Now if you go to the drag strip a lot, then of course a new diff first. And I think one of the first upgrades should be some subframe connectors.

**35th-ANV-SS** · 07-20-2011, 03:07 PM

Agreed, but we have to assume that the OP does have the money to throw down for a read end since the question is "rear end or headers".

**Knight** · 07-20-2011, 03:15 PM

My last and final problem with the stock rear happened on the street. Granted, I'm pushing the hp a little higher than most, but I babied it expecting to have problems. And I did. It's all a matter of perspective I guess. I wasn't comfortable knowing the stocker might leave me stranded because it couldn't hold up. Now I don't worry. Granted, anything can happen, but that is an accepted risk. I've done everything in my power to have a safe, reliable, and strong car. But I can also use it to it's full potential too, without worry.

It's the OP's decision in the end. But, what good will headers do when he can't drive the car due to the rear diff. being fragged?

**transamtom** · 07-20-2011, 03:44 PM

I blew everything up in my 1994 TA A4 at least twice except the rear end,that was the only thing on that car that didn't break in over 500 strip passes and lots of street action.

Granted that slug didn't leave too hard my best 60 ft was a 1.92 with a 2800 Yank stall and DR's.

My buddies 96 Z28 got 1.7X 60's with a 3600 stall Vig,it took him forever to break that 10 bolt.

**Firebirdjones** · 07-20-2011, 04:34 PM

Originally Posted by Too Fast

^^^BC maybe some people don't have the money for a new ~$3k diff, and may have money for $500-1200 for some nice headers. If you don't abuse the diff, it will last under moderate power increases for a time. Now if you go to the drag strip a lot, then of course a new diff first. And I think one of the first upgrades should be some subframe connectors.

Ah, the lovely world of cars and the need for speed. You have to pay to play. Thanks to the bastard rear suspension design, it makes aftermarket rearends costly. Personally, for a track type of car that see's street use, I'd rather start with a friendlier platform. But we have to work with what we have. In this case the rearends are spendy. I still don't believe that should deter anyone from upgrading that first and foremost. Quite honestly, if you are hard on the car even the slightest bit, that rearend really becomes a safety hazard, ask me how I know.

I never jumped on the subframe connector bandwagon with these cars. Never had a problem in 15 years without them. I don't autocross them though either and they aren't my primary track car. I do agree if autocrossing is in the works, or some very serious drag strip time, then connectors are a worthwhile addition.

**Firebirdjones** · 07-20-2011, 04:41 PM

Originally Posted by Knight

My last and final problem with the stock rear happened on the street. Granted, I'm pushing the hp a little higher than most, but I babied it expecting to have problems. And I did. It's all a matter of perspective I guess. I wasn't comfortable knowing the stocker might leave me stranded because it couldn't hold up. Now I don't worry. Granted, anything can happen, but that is an accepted risk. I've done everything in my power to have a safe, reliable, and strong car. But I can also use it to it's full potential too, without worry.

And this is exactly my point. Why even take the chance? It's not a matter of "IF" it will break, it's a matter of "WHEN"

It's even more than a worrysome matter of being stranded, they are also a safety hazzard. I've snapped one in third gear (70-80 mph??) which also took out the transmission and laid down tranny fluid. Once on the back tires I nearly hit the wall,,,,,,TWICE!!!
Not only could I have easily wrecked the car, or even crossed the center line and taken out the other car,,,I could have been hurt as well. This turned out to be a very expensive repair (rearend and transmission) that cost much more than a measly $3,000
It could have easily cost more if I had wrecked the car, or worse yet, wrecked the car in the other lane too. That has lawsuit written all over it, not to mention most all insurance companies don't cover your car at the strip, you're on your own.

**0rion** · 07-20-2011, 11:53 PM

rear end first with a nice set of gears.........I'd do that anyday over headers on these cars.

**Too Fast** · 07-21-2011, 02:23 AM

Well it seems opinions on this vary. And we all know opinions are like a......s. Everybody has one lol.

OP asked and now he has some.

**jfl330** · 07-21-2011, 05:04 AM

Originally Posted by Too Fast

I gained ground clearance with my Hookers. Their ORY sits higher than the stock Y, but I did have to massage it a bit on the top of driver's side to get the extra clearance. My car isn't lowered, and I can fit a Coke can under the headers, and almost under the ORY.

Thanks, will keep the Hookers in mind.

Jon