View Poll Results: turbo or super?

Voters
876. You may not vote on this poll
  • I prefer a supercharger to turbos.......

    389 44.41%
  • I prefer turbos to superchargers........

    487 55.59%
Page 14 of 24 FirstFirst ... 101112131415161718 ... LastLast
Results 261 to 280 of 464

Turbo or Supercharger poll

This is a discussion on Turbo or Supercharger poll within the Forced Induction forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; ...

  1. #261
    car enthusiast djvaly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Philly area
    Posts
    9,863

  2. #262
    !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ATCharming's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Rockford, IL
    Age
    26
    Posts
    8,303

    Silver
    2000 Camaro SS

    sounds good. thanks guys, its not like i even have the money for any of it right now, or even an fbody yet... i was just wondering for future plans

  3. #263
    car enthusiast djvaly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Philly area
    Posts
    9,863
    get a mazda miata

  4. #264
    car enthusiast djvaly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Philly area
    Posts
    9,863

  5. #265
    !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ATCharming's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Rockford, IL
    Age
    26
    Posts
    8,303

    Silver
    2000 Camaro SS

    Quote Originally Posted by djvaly View Post
    get a mazda miata
    yea... ummmm...

  6. #266
    no more 4th gen secondgearscratch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    St. Louis, Missouri
    Age
    29
    Posts
    2,463

    Pewter
    2000 z28

    this poll has me getting anxious....ive got the fabrication itch today. may have to hit up a junk yard....

  7. #267
    car enthusiast djvaly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Philly area
    Posts
    9,863
    you have an itch for the pole?

  8. #268
    no more 4th gen secondgearscratch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    St. Louis, Missouri
    Age
    29
    Posts
    2,463

    Pewter
    2000 z28

    Quote Originally Posted by djvaly View Post
    you have an itch for the pole?
    sick bastard....i have an itch for the boobies!!!!

    newly single!


  9. #269
    car enthusiast djvaly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Philly area
    Posts
    9,863
    so ahem. back on track, turbo or s/c ?

  10. #270
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Horsham
    Posts
    30

    Black
    97 Trans AM

    Hold-up

    so if s/c and and turbos both help the same and produce the boost that makes them the same thing

  11. #271
    car enthusiast djvaly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Philly area
    Posts
    9,863
    turbo vs s/c
    pros vs cons

    both turbo and superchargers force more air to burn more fuel.
    the turbo is exhaust gas driven forced induction, the supercharger uses an air compressor to get more air into the combustion chamber.

    superchargers can eat away as much as a third of the total crankshaft power of the engine. in many applications they are less efficient than turbochargers. on the flip side turbo setup have the turbo lag in which initial acceleration from low RPMs is limited by the lack of sufficient exhaust gas pressure.

    turbo setup can be damaged by dirty or ineffective oil, and most manufacturers recommend more frequent oil changes for turbocharged engines, and use synthetic oil.

    the downside to supercharging is that compressing the air increases its temperature which causes pre-ignition and detonation (bad air fuel mix can damage an engine)

    now talking about altitudes, the amount of power in the gas is the difference between the exhaust pressure (turbo) and air pressure induction (s/c) which increases with altitude, so turbos generally have much better altitude performance.

  12. #272
    !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ATCharming's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Rockford, IL
    Age
    26
    Posts
    8,303

    Silver
    2000 Camaro SS

    Quote Originally Posted by djvaly View Post
    turbo vs s/c
    pros vs cons

    both turbo and superchargers force more air to burn more fuel.
    the turbo is exhaust gas driven forced induction, the supercharger uses an air compressor to get more air into the combustion chamber.

    superchargers can eat away as much as a third of the total crankshaft power of the engine. in many applications they are less efficient than turbochargers. on the flip side turbo setup have the turbo lag in which initial acceleration from low RPMs is limited by the lack of sufficient exhaust gas pressure.

    turbo setup can be damaged by dirty or ineffective oil, and most manufacturers recommend more frequent oil changes for turbocharged engines, and use synthetic oil.

    the downside to supercharging is that compressing the air increases its temperature which causes pre-ignition and detonation (bad air fuel mix can damage an engine)

    now talking about altitudes, the amount of power in the gas is the difference between the exhaust pressure (turbo) and air pressure induction (s/c) which increases with altitude, so turbos generally have much better altitude performance.
    what do u mean by the supercharger eating away crankshaft power? that doesnt make sense to me, if they create power...

  13. #273
    car enthusiast djvaly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Philly area
    Posts
    9,863
    they create power but eat away crankshaft power in the process. it take power to spin the blower, but the net result is gain in power.

  14. #274
    !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ATCharming's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Rockford, IL
    Age
    26
    Posts
    8,303

    Silver
    2000 Camaro SS

    Quote Originally Posted by djvaly View Post
    they create power but eat away crankshaft power in the process. it take power to spin the blower, but the net result is gain in power.
    ohh.. do certain s/cs take up lesspower than others?

    so when superchargers say they add (for example purposes only. random number) 120hp, really they are first eating up a certain amount, then making enough power to make up for what its eating up PLUS another 120?

  15. #275
    car enthusiast djvaly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Philly area
    Posts
    9,863
    , it depends on what your boost level is and the setup, I like Procharger better than Vortec but that's my 2 cents. also get an intercooler with it, the cooler the air the more hp...

  16. #276
    doesn'tplaywellwithothers superchargedblackgto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Mayberry....(Indiana)
    Posts
    1,634

    Black
    2004 GTO

    Quote Originally Posted by djvaly View Post
    , it depends on what your boost level is and the setup, I like Procharger better than Vortec but that's my 2 cents. also get an intercooler with it, the cooler the air the more hp...
    OK DJ...I got to say the new S/C are way more efficient than the ones of yesteryear....@ 60mph my maggie scavanges 1/2 Crank HP to run it....now it is blowing out the bypass not making boost....but when you kick it down makes serious HP and roots blowers make better torque throught the rpm range....but you can make way more power with turbos...because you can crank up the boost...unlike s/c you have to change pulleys, port it ect....my .02 worth....lol..I know
    http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s...gto/img001.jpg look @ that TQ curve

  17. #277
    car enthusiast djvaly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Philly area
    Posts
    9,863
    love the dyno

  18. #278
    Member RJWZ28's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Sunniest city on Earth
    Age
    31
    Posts
    612
    2011 Silverado CC 4x4 6.2

    I'll be getting a turbo, if you have fuel injection the turbo is the way to go. If your old school with the carb, put a blower on it and go, turbos with carbs are peaky, temperamental, and harder to tune, due to the lack of linear power gain. A guy out here by me supercharged his LT1 and it sounds great and rips like mad, but a turbo is my preference when electronic fuel injection is involved.

  19. #279
    Member ericwilloughby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Louisville KY
    Age
    48
    Posts
    178

    Yellow
    2005 GTO

    Quote Originally Posted by ATCharming View Post
    whichone hurts gas mileage more?
    The sc is the only one that hurts MPG. Because it's using crank power and compressing all the time at all RPM and throttle positions. The roots type like the Maggie have a bypass valve that helps but still. The centri has no bypass but since it is nothing more than a turbo driven by a belt instead of exhaust it makes little boost at < 3,000 rpm so doesn't hurt MPG much.

    The turbo on the other hand increases MPG slightly. There is no lose in power at the crank to turn it. The backpressure it puts on the exhaust causes some of the exhaust to stay the cylinder after the exhaust stroke and that has the same effect as a EGR valve.

    Both increase pressure in the cyl and that makes for higher dynamic compression ratio with increases efficiency. It's just that there is much less lose in power to turn a turbo.
    Last edited by ericwilloughby; 06-08-2007 at 01:43 PM.

  20. #280
    Member ericwilloughby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Louisville KY
    Age
    48
    Posts
    178

    Yellow
    2005 GTO

    Quote Originally Posted by djvaly View Post
    turbo vs s/c
    pros vs cons

    both turbo and superchargers force more air to burn more fuel.
    the turbo is exhaust gas driven forced induction, the supercharger uses an air compressor to get more air into the combustion chamber.

    superchargers can eat away as much as a third of the total crankshaft power of the engine. in many applications they are less efficient than turbochargers. on the flip side turbo setup have the turbo lag in which initial acceleration from low RPMs is limited by the lack of sufficient exhaust gas pressure.

    turbo setup can be damaged by dirty or ineffective oil, and most manufacturers recommend more frequent oil changes for turbocharged engines, and use synthetic oil.

    the downside to supercharging is that compressing the air increases its temperature which causes pre-ignition and detonation (bad air fuel mix can damage an engine)

    now talking about altitudes, the amount of power in the gas is the difference between the exhaust pressure (turbo) and air pressure induction (s/c) which increases with altitude, so turbos generally have much better altitude performance.

    Not busting on you here, would just like to clear up a few things.

    All turbo's and all super chargers are nothing but air compressors. As a matter of fact the Procharger, Vortex, centri type, actually use a turbo's impeller wheel to force the air. The only dif is the sc is driven by taking power from the crank to turn a pulley, and the turbo gets its push from the exhaust gasses still burning in the pipes.

    I think a third is on the very high side for the amount of power robbed. I've been involved in some testing and for the normal street car centi making about 500 RWHP about 75 HP extra was used to turn the sc. In other words the car was making about 575 but that much was taken off of the front of the crank to turn the sc. That's about a 13% lose.

    You might think that the turbo on the same car, same boost, would make 575 but not quite. 555ish. The turbo, in blocking the exhaust to make it spin robs the engine of about 20 hp because the exhaust has a much harder time getting out of the engine so a full,fresh air charge, can't quite get in. Again, this is also why turbos make slightly better MPG than N/A.

    Turbo lag is nothing compared to the boost a centri, procharger, vortex, can not make at low RPM's. Lag is gone by about 2,200 rpm on a turbo. Boost doesn't hit it's peak on a centi until red line. Because being belt driven, it's speed is always dependant on the rpm of the engine. The only type that makes more low end boost, below 2,200 rpm than a turbo is a roots, Maggie, type supercharger. But these roots type kill you on the top end where it matters most. The only time you miss that 2,200 rpm or less power is on the launch and you better have some drag slicks. Anyway, what's the point, if your looking for power down that low get a high stall converter and just move the launch rpm up to 3,000 or higher.

    As for the oil. All of them have to be changed. Change it every 3,000 and it wont matter. On the down side for the Procharger, you have to change it's oil in a separate job because it has a self contained system. A little more work.

    Compressing the air, no matter what system you use, increases it's temp. And if you are looking for more than 6 psi you need an intercooler no matter what system you use. All kits I can think of come with an intercooler anyway. Except for the entry level STS turbo kit, which runs at 6 psi.

    The altitude part made little since to me but I think I know what you are getting at. The sc, being belt and gear driven, compresses the air by a factor of x. Lets say that at sea level you are making 14.7 psi of boost. That is double atmosphere. If you were to drive up a very tall mountain and the atmo pressure at the top was only 8 psi. You would only be making 8 psi of boost up there.

    A turbo on the other hand actually controls the boost pressure via the wastegate. Where there is NO pressure control on a sc, just controlled shaft speed based on RPM. The turbo will make whatever psi you have it set to make no matter the atmospheric pressure.
    Last edited by ericwilloughby; 06-08-2007 at 01:47 PM.

Page 14 of 24 FirstFirst ... 101112131415161718 ... LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. supercharger or turbo
    By pipes_ta in forum Forced Induction
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 11-17-2009, 02:34 PM
  2. Question: turbo vs supercharger
    By SSMOKEshow in forum Forced Induction
    Replies: 29
    Last Post: 02-17-2008, 08:59 AM
  3. Supercharger or Turbo? What do you have/like
    By fastfirebird2002 in forum Forced Induction
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 01-27-2008, 11:58 PM
  4. who says you can't turbo a supercharger?
    By third_shift|studios in forum Almost Anything Goes
    Replies: 33
    Last Post: 12-05-2007, 10:02 AM
  5. A4- supercharger or turbo?
    By socialdbob in forum Forced Induction
    Replies: 28
    Last Post: 12-21-2006, 07:31 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •