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Rear diff and tranny help

This is a discussion on Rear diff and tranny help within the Forced Induction forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; I am getting a build list together for a procharger set up almost identical to 35th anv. I was looking ...

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    Rear diff and tranny help

    I am getting a build list together for a procharger set up almost identical to 35th anv. I was looking around for stronger rear ends and tranny,

    Wave track diff, then the 35 spline for that, 4channel ABS/TCS with exciter rings, Backbrace, 4.11 gears, aluminum center, plus the sway bar brackets, (standard OEM wheel studs)?, adjusty chromoly LCA's, and chromoly Panhard rod, tie down brackets, and timkin wheel bearings for $5200. That seemed high, is it just me?

    Also, will a built 60e handle the horse? I was looking for 750-850 wheel horse, but I also want to DD this in the nicer seasons, this is my first build, so all the help will he appreciated. I can lower the numbers if that # is too high to street it.

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    Moderator 35th-ANV-SS's Avatar
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    Pretty sure the WaveTrac will do you just fine, but if you really want a bullet-proof rear end, the Dana 60 offered by Strange is the strongest on the market.

    I really can't imagine having another 250-350rwhp on top of what I have and the car being able to hook at all on the street.

    You are going to need to run a 315/335 drag radial at minimum, which means you'll need to figure out what wheel spacing you have. What size tire are you currently running? Depending on your set-up, you "might" need longer wheel studs.

    I would also list suspension and other mods for other viewers.

    - Torque arm?
    - Drive-shaft?
    - Sub-frame connectors?
    - Sway bars?
    - Shocks/springs?
    - Stall? Size?
    - Cam specs?

    A 4.11 gear is a very low gear for an auto and typically with a FI car, you want a higher gear ratio so you're able to take advantage of being in boost longer. That will depend on your exact set-up though.

    I don't know for sure, but I would also guess with that kind of power you will probably need to stiffen up the chassis above and beyond what sub-frame connectors do. My guess would be a roll-cage. You'd need one anyway if you were to ever run at the track.

    You're going to need to purchase the F1A Procharger, because with just a D1SC like I have you might be pushing the limits of boost to hit those numbers. The D1SC can only make around 14-16psi on a LS1 motor and you will need to run both a large front mount intercooler and a methanol injection system to keep it safe.

    Get the Aster tensioner bracket. Pushing that much boost and your belt starts to slip. The last thing you want happening is throwing a belt.

    You'll also need dual in-take fuel pumps. A single pump won't support that much fuel demand.

    Any idea on what size injectors you are going to need?

    Lastly, I hope you can handle a car with this much power

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    Price on the rear does seem high, even with the added suspension components. Is that the installed price?

    For comparison: Moser 12 bolt, 33 spline axles, True-Trac, 3.73's, welded sway bar and relocation brackets, 4 channel ABS, in bare steel - $2,800 shipped.

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    Moderator 35th-ANV-SS's Avatar
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    Forgot to mention, my Moser 9" with TrueTrac differential, 31 spline axles, ABS, new reluctor rings, relocation brackets for the LCA's and 4.11 gear was $2500. That included it being painted.

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    I just ordered a Strange S60 - 4 channel ABS, 35 spline axles, S-Trac clutchless diff, welded relocation brackets, 4.10 gear and longer studs. $2,593 shipped to my door.

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    With that rear end comes PST 4.5" driveshaft with forged yoke. I planned on sub frame braces, new shocks and springs, I was going to wait on the stahl to be able to launch at my max torque rpm, custom cam from Bob that he suggested: Brute Speed forced induction camshaft I'm not sure if that's s sponsor, if not I appologize. I'm running 275/40/17. I'm starting to realize that horse number may be excessive. I want my car to be crazy fast, but at the same time driveable. If I decided to just go with the same set up as you Jon but I built the bottom end, with that cam, diamond pistons, compstar rods and total seal rings would that be more streetable? Then I'm still un sure what to do about my tranny. The torque arm already comes attached to the M9, chromoly panhard tod, Chromoly LCA's. I'm just not sure I could stomach $5,200 for the rear end and $4900 for the built 60e. That's almost $10,000 right there.

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    Now that I'm looking at it 800 seems excessive, Jon I might just end up going with your set up, just build my lower end. What tranny should I go with at this point? And where did you find your 9" for that much less?

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    Moderator 35th-ANV-SS's Avatar
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    I'm not trying to steer you away from any HP goal you have, but you really need to determine for yourself through asking questions and research what you really want to do with your car.

    Why do you want the HP range that you are specifying for street use?

    You are looking at the M9 rear end which uses a fabricated housing and costs a lot more than the standard Moser 9 housing. Coupled with the WaveTrac, this is why your cost is over 1,000 more than what the rest of us are paying. That rear end you are specifying is basically for drag-strip use.

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    I was wanting that hp range so I can beat virtually anything that tries to race me anywhere I go. I don't want it to be a drag car, that's exactly the opposite. I want to be able to continue driving it every day, just with a.. Pleasurable kick when I stomp on her. Your hp #'s will give me that. But if I had a little more, say 600-650 that seems more reasonable. If I had a forged bottom end, would I be able to push more boost, plus the gains from the cam, put me near 650? Your not steering me away, your just pointing out the things that I haven't gotten to yet. This build is still in the future. But I want to have some stuff done this summer.

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    Moderator 35th-ANV-SS's Avatar
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    When I hit the throttle...I get slammed back into my seat.

    I'd find it hard pressed for just about anything around my part of town to beat me.

    Going from a relatively stock Camaro SS to a Procharger set-up with 8psi, I would compare it to going from a pedal bicycle to jumping on a Harley.

    If you have a forged bottom end, you'll have no issue running more boost. For comparison, at around 10psi I was pushing 540rwhp. At 8-9psi I hit the 500rwhp mark.

    One thing you'll need to figure out for sure before buying a rear end is what gears you'll need. Gears usually go along with your cam selection, but in this case, since you're going to be boosted, the impact not be the same.

    In my M6, I have 4.11 gears and 1st gear is almost useless. Guessing in an A4, 1st would be completely useless.

    When I start from a dig, the RPM's jump REALLY fast. I have to be ready to shift damn near instantly. You definitely have to be quick on the draw with it. Hitting the rev limiter for me isn't ideal...when you do that you're cutting off fuel delivery to the motor...and running lean while boosted in the upper RPM range where boost is at its maximum in a centrifugal supercharger set-up like Procharger is a very bad thing.

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    Anyone have suggestions for my tranny options and my gearing ? 3.73 instead of 4.11?

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    Moderator 35th-ANV-SS's Avatar
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    Have you talked with a builder at all? Any suggestions from them? I would guess anywhere from a 3.23 to 3.73...no lower than 3.73.

    I've been considering a 3.42 gear on my set-up. I need to determine where I would be in the 1/4 mile though running that gear with what tire selection I end up going with.

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    I have not talked to a builder yet. Is there one you Reccomend?

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    I was also told that trutrac was only good for 400-500 hp. So I'd need to go with the wavetrac for 500+.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 200z28ss View Post
    I was also told that trutrac was only good for 400-500 hp. So I'd need to go with the wavetrac for 500+.
    I went with the Wavetrac because of the lifetime warranty.
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    The strange S60 now has the s-trac, they say it is comparable to the wavertrac.

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    If you keep it under 700 h.p. I have no hesitation recommending a Performabuilt transmission. I have their Level II Pro Race 4L60E in our car along with their 3,200 stall converter. Came with a 2 year warranty and a reasonably priced re-fresh offer if you pile the miles on it. If you are interested, let me know as I toured their facility and posted a thread on my trans being built. If you decide to go north of that power level, and want to maintain overdrive capability, then a 4L80E is the way to go.

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    Moser M9 with trac loc, 31 spline, 3.73, black powder coat, PST 3.5" driveshaft, timkin bearings, tie down brackets(do I need those?) chromoly lca,& panhard rod(do I need new lca's?) 4 channel abs/tcs with exciter rings= $4,229.99 (torque arm included)

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    Moser M9 with trac loc, 31 spline, 3.73, black powder coat, PST 3.5" driveshaft, timkin bearings, tie down brackets(do I need those?) chromoly lca,& panhard rod(do I need new lca's?) 4 channel abs/tcs with exciter rings= $4,229.99 (torque arm included)

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    Yeah I'm definitely interested I'll send you a pm

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