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general questions about a procharger

This is a discussion on general questions about a procharger within the Forced Induction forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; Originally Posted by Ed Blown Vert Yep. With more power, you don't need as much stall. X2 on that. I ...

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    ;) Packy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Blown Vert View Post
    Yep. With more power, you don't need as much stall.

    X2 on that. I wanted a 3800 stall but lately have figured out that mine is more like a 4200-4400. Just a bit too loose for a procharged application IMO. I posted that Yank 3400 because I have drove a Procharged Car with that stall and it was pretty tight and had good DD characteristics. It is pricey ($945) but you have to pay to play.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 35th-ANV-SS View Post
    Ed -

    How much could one expect to spend on forged connecting rods/pistons and the installation of them?

    Depends on the shop but anywhere from around $2500-3500 for the parts with the motor work and if you want the motor installed then add another $1000-1500 usually to install the motor. You just have to get quotes from them.

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    The red dragon bpopham22's Avatar
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    Yea I want good dd characteristics but I guess ill have to ride in one or drive one to see how it really feels and I want to forge the internals for reliability

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    rice,its what's fo dinner LeadFarmer's Avatar
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    WoW this thread has scared me shitless into killing all thoughts of going F/I one day with my ls1, 10K+ just to make 10-12# semi reliably I dunno but from my noob perspective if someone like OP wants big boost it just seems like it would be so much easier to just get a car built for boost from the factory....say something along the lines of a termy?





    It's just that from everything I've heard over the years of ppl boosting these LSX motors I've kinda come to the conclusion that these cars just don't like boost.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeadFarmer View Post
    WoW this thread has scared me shitless into killing all thoughts of going F/I one day with my ls1, 10K+ just to make 10-12# semi reliably I dunno but from my noob perspective if someone like OP wants big boost it just seems like it would be so much easier to just get a car built for boost from the factory....say something along the lines of a termy?





    It's just that from everything I've heard over the years of ppl boosting these LSX motors I've kinda come to the conclusion that these cars just don't like boost.....

    Nitrous works better for the once in a while warrior. However with that said you can run 8 psi with good reliability as long as you fuel it properly and get a good dyno tune on it. Some have luck with more boost when they add meth to the equation.

    The factory LQ9 motor holds up to boost extremely well! There have been many that have thrown up to 15 psi at that and it holds strong with the right tuning and fuel mods.

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    rice,its what's fo dinner LeadFarmer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Packy View Post
    Nitrous works better for the once in a while warrior. However with that said you can run 8 psi with good reliability as long as you fuel it properly and get a good dyno tune on it. Some have luck with more boost when they add meth to the equation.

    The factory LQ9 motor holds up to boost extremely well! There have been many that have thrown up to 15 psi at that and it holds strong with the right tuning and fuel mods.
    I'm not saying it isn't possibly, but it just seems that the odds of a build like that holding up for awhile (especially in the case of a DD) doesn't seem to good. Even under the best circumstances I've never heard of a F/I LSX going more than 40k+ miles. Where as in cars like termies, Sti's, evo's, srt-4's last well over 100K+ mi. on the same amount of boost that an LS1 will last a max of 50K. If I was OP and I was planning on DD my build I would def. take the H/C/I/E route. There are several ppl on this forum who have achieved 500HP+ with a setup like that and have retained close to stock characteristics without having to constantly worry about nuking something if they romp the gas every once in a while.

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    Moderator 35th-ANV-SS's Avatar
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    I've never seen 1 person make 500+ HP with a LS1 H/C/I combo. Unless you are talking about CRANK HP.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 35th-ANV-SS View Post
    I've never seen 1 person make 500+ HP with a LS1 H/C/I combo. Unless you are talking about CRANK HP.
    what about slowass? Or was that quite 500?

    edit: I meant whp, but I didn't necessarily mean 500whp on stock cubes ls1 though. Throw in a 454 and call it day lol
    Last edited by LeadFarmer; 07-31-2010 at 10:11 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeadFarmer View Post
    what about slowass? Or was that quite 500?

    edit: I meant whp, but I didn't necessarily mean 500whp on stock cubes ls1 though. Throw in a 454 and call it day lol
    he has a 402...not a 346

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeadFarmer View Post
    I'm not saying it isn't possibly, but it just seems that the odds of a build like that holding up for awhile (especially in the case of a DD) doesn't seem to good. Even under the best circumstances I've never heard of a F/I LSX going more than 40k+ miles. Where as in cars like termies, Sti's, evo's, srt-4's last well over 100K+ mi. on the same amount of boost that an LS1 will last a max of 50K. If I was OP and I was planning on DD my build I would def. take the H/C/I/E route. There are several ppl on this forum who have achieved 500HP+ with a setup like that and have retained close to stock characteristics without having to constantly worry about nuking something if they romp the gas every once in a while.
    Well now you must have had lots of experience with this topic in your 19 years on this world. Show me a Daily Driveable H/C/I car that makes 500 to the wheels... And a 454... Okay GTFO here with that 454 and be done shit. There are plenty of LS1's that have and are currently running into the 100,000 mile and longer mark with Prochargers, Maggies, and Vortechs. They only run 8 psi of boost and have tuned very well for it. The OP initially said that he wanted to run 10-12 psi that is why we said he should forge the bottom end first. Of course Termi's and etc will hold more boost safely. They come with fully forged internals from the factory.
    Last edited by Packy; 08-01-2010 at 09:03 AM.
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    ^lol I never claimed to have loads of experience on the matter. It also doesn't take a mechanical guru to tell someone that running 10-12psi on a daily driver car that isn't meant for F/I isn't exactly a sound investment in the reliability department. I'm not trying to tell the OP it isn't possible, I'm just pointing out that there are other options to achieving the power levels he wants.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeadFarmer View Post
    ^lol I never claimed to have loads of experience on the matter. It also doesn't take a mechanical guru to tell someone that running 10-12psi on a daily driver car that isn't meant for F/I isn't exactly a sound investment in the reliability department. I'm not trying to tell the OP it isn't possible, I'm just pointing out that there are other options to achieving the power levels he wants.
    well what do you think a forged shortblock is made for

    difference between a 4.6 termi forged shortblock
    and a 5.7 ls1 forged shortblock = nothing ...both will handle boost and last.

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    Packy or Ed...

    What's your take on running boost on M6 cars? I heard today at the track that the boost needs to be controlled while shifting.

    Any input on that?

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    Quote Originally Posted by 35th-ANV-SS View Post
    Packy or Ed...

    What's your take on running boost on M6 cars? I heard today at the track that the boost needs to be controlled while shifting.

    Any input on that?
    isn't that what boost controllers do ? control the amount of boost per rpm and cuts/retards boost during shifts ? i believe packy ran his car boosted when he had a m6 in it...

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeadFarmer View Post
    ^lol I never claimed to have loads of experience on the matter. It also doesn't take a mechanical guru to tell someone that running 10-12psi on a daily driver car that isn't meant for F/I isn't exactly a sound investment in the reliability department. I'm not trying to tell the OP it isn't possible, I'm just pointing out that there are other options to achieving the power levels he wants.
    Like I said show these magical 500 hp H/C/I daily drivers and I will believe you. The LS1 is meant for F/I it just isn't meant for 10-20 psi the way a forged shortblock is until it has forged pistons and connecting rods with a few other things. However with 8 psi the LS1 is just as if not more potent than some of the pullied Termi's and twin screwed Termi's out there. 8 psi from a D-1SC on a 346 LS1 with stock CR will bring into the 500-550 range with a decent tune. Yeah I hear ya on the other ways the to achieve power but he specifically wanted to go with a mild boost set-up for its DD reliability which we all know is what the Procharger and other S/C systems is designed for. You can keep stock driveability and have 500 rwhp to tap into at the push of the throttle when you want with no bottle to fill and no worries other than traction once you have it set-up and tuned.
    Last edited by Packy; 08-02-2010 at 06:57 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 35th-ANV-SS View Post
    Packy or Ed...

    What's your take on running boost on M6 cars? I heard today at the track that the boost needs to be controlled while shifting.

    Any input on that?
    You don't need to run a boost controller with an M6 supercharged application because they have a bypass valve built into the system. What that does is vent the boost into the atmosphere or intake track when you are not under load such as revving or between shifts. Now there have been some that have ran different variations of boost controllers but mainly the one I have seen was one guy on Tech ran his car with a smaller pulley to make more boost in the low to mid range and then he controlled the boost with some type of wastegate in order not to boost it too high in the upper rpm band. In doing this he achieved more power under the curve and continued make good power up top also. Boost controller are mainly for turbo applications so with a the turn of a dial or button you can run more boost for when you wanna go to the track and load a race gas tune in the car fill her up with some good gas to your liking and let it loose. I myself have never heard of a boost controller being used in a S/C application.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Packy View Post
    You don't need to run a boost controller with an M6 supercharged application because they have a bypass valve built into the system. What that does is vent the boost into the atmosphere or intake track when you are not under load such as revving or between shifts. Now there have been some that have ran different variations of boost controllers but mainly the one I have seen was one guy on Tech ran his car with a smaller pulley to make more boost in the low to mid range and then he controlled the boost with some type of wastegate in order not to boost it too high in the upper rpm band. In doing this he achieved more power under the curve and continued make good power up top also. Boost controller are mainly for turbo applications so with a the turn of a dial or button you can run more boost for when you wanna go to the track and load a race gas tune in the car fill her up with some good gas to your liking and let it loose. I myself have never heard of a boost controller being used in a S/C application.
    ahhh good to know

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    Thanks Packy. That is what I thought. I've only seen boost controllers in Turbo apps too, that's why I asked because I had never heard of it and the guy I talked to at the track had my mind spinning a bit.

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    Here is a good video about bypass valves. [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wX63yHGbDQk[/ame]

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    I still wouldnt run 8lbs on a stock block, but thats just me I guess. It has been done, it is being done, and it will be done but I personally will forge the internals if I wanted to run boost on a DD. Doesnt really make sense to drop 6k on a s/c kit and try to save 2k on the motor.

    And to the 19yr old kid, you obviously have no clue what your talking about. No LS1 car has made 500whp on a stock block with just H/C/I. yeah Mr. Luos is pushing 530 horses on the stock block.

    Terminators were designed for boosted applications. Like Packy said, they come off the factory floor with a blower and forged internals. You cant really compare a 5.7L naturally aspirated engine to a superchared 4.6, its like apples to oranges.
    "Life is to short to drive a slow car"

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