CCW in Action. (vid)

[hutch1999]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3AA_dgRdDhk"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3AA_dgRdDhk[/ame]

Seen this on another forum. I thought it was a good vid.

Here is what the guy said about it.

"My Justified shooting expieriance.
I put this in the Home defense section because this seemed like the most appropriate section. I was involved in a shooting at my work at a Super 8 motel off brice rd in Columbus Oh. This happend on the sixth of last month. I didn't want to post anything untill things had cooled down and I got a feel for what the law enforcement officals thought. I am pleased to say that the Columbus Police department, were very professional about the whole situation, and even when they had to do there usual routine, never made me feel like a criminal, and they kept me well hidden from the media. I was expecting the worst from the police from all the negative things I've heard people say happen to them after a shooting, so I was very relieved. The officers that I was with did their best to make sure that I was ok, and made me as comfortable as they could. Anyway, I'd like to address some of the things that I learned from this confrontation, and also re-address some things that most of us in the ccw world already know.

A confrontation will be extremely quick and extremely violent: I teach this in my concealed carry class, but never really thought about it. From the time that the Robber walked in and pulled his gun, to the point where he was lying on the pavement was 13 seconds. The shooting portion from when my gun cleared the holster to him on the ground was under 3 seconds (I got these times from the time recorder on the security camera video)

You must remain alert, ALWAYS: I was unprepared for this, I must admit. When he walked into the lobby, I tottaly didn't even notice him. I was busy checking a guest in on my computer that I didn't even look up. It wasn't untill the other desk clerk started acting frantic, and the kid came behind the counter that I looked up and saw him wearing a mask and a gun in his hands.

Holster options: I now know that I don't want any type of retention strap on my firearm. I had one during this incident and realise had I not had the other desk clerk there to conceal my actions of drawing, I don't think I would have been quick enough. When I practice drawing, I always practice undoing the strap at the same time to make it quick, but you MAY loose your fine motor skills, which makes it just a little more difficult, especially for me because I was using a Glock 27, which is a little difficult to get a grip on to begin with, because I can't use my back fingers on it because it is so small. I was using a cheapie nylon, but will now be upgrading to a Galco retention style. In my opinion, just pay the money to get a good holster. Also, I know for sure that an ankle rig would have been almost useless. I think they are good for just BUGs.

Point shooting: As I stated before, everything happend so fast. I didn't use the sights. I used muscle memmory and point shooting. I believe it is imperitive to get yourself trained to shoot quickly(double and triple tap drills)and to get your mucles used to your relative point of aim. More than likely you will never use your sights. It will all be point shooting.

Never say anything: You will probably want to talk about this expieriance, especially with the police. DON'T DO IT!! Anything you have to say right after the shooting you will have to say the next day. No matter how cool calm and collected you think you will be or feel, you still need to calm down. I didn't realise I was wound so tight, untill I loosened up. Anything you have to say, can come through a lawyer. I gave no statement that night, and looked for a lawyer the next day just in case. I had other witnesses who gave statements, so I never even needed to give one, and haven't yet. Why bother if it's not needed. It could only hurt you to give a statement that night, waiting to give a statement through a lawyer never hurt anybody.

These are just some things I thought I should share. I may post a few more things later, but for right now this is it. If you would like to read a little more about the shooting, you can yahoo search it. Type in "shooting at 2055 brice rd" or you can look it up on the civialian self defense blog.

more info posted by another member on the forum:

He is 22 years old.
He is an NRA instructor.
Says he's put 10's of thousands of rounds downrange.
He didn't produce or post the video. His roommate did.
He was using a Glock 27 with 165 grain Golden Sabers.
They over penetrated twice and the third stuck in his shoulder bone.
He's switching to 155 grain Gold Dots.
He yelled at the guy and the Perp raised his gun. That is when he starts to duck-flinch and starts shooting.
His co-worker wants to get her CCW now and he hopes to be the one to sign her off for it.
He didn't get sued or prosecuted.
Says the Police and prosecutor were pretty supportive.
He says and i believe him the apparent nearness of the child is due to camera angle

[Sarge]

Practice practice practice paid off for this brave young man. Nice job....

[hutch1999]

You should see some of the liberals commenting on the other forum. They are saying things like "was it worth the risk of getting shot" or "he just wanted the money, was it worth the chance of killing him?" they then got pwned by a ton of members posting vids and links where the cashiers gave up the money without a fight and still got shot or killed.

[Sarge]

Liberals are called pussies down here in South Texas...we call them that for a reason....coward bastards....

[txz28]

Liberals are called pussies down here in South Texas...we call them that for a reason....coward bastards....

term is good in East Texas as well sir sarge

[slims00ls1z28]

Too bad the SOB perp didn't die. Wish It would have shown the perp's face the moment he saw down the barrel.

[hutch1999]

Too bad the SOB perp didn't die. Wish It would have shown the perp's face the moment he saw down the barrel.

yeah it really is too bad the POS didn't die. Then the liberal pussies would have had all sorts to say.

"he just wanted money, why kill him?"

"poor lil black ex-con needed some cash, was it worth his life?"

"good job taken the life of someone over a little bit of money"

I've heard a lot of bs lines just like this on other vids. Guess what, if a mother fucker is willing to point a gun in my face or families he better be willing to die. Because that's threatening me, it goes beyond the money aspect in my eyes.

[2000LS1Bird]

I'm surprised the arguments haven't been against him shooting with a mother and child between him and the assailant.

After being hit, the bad guy could very easily hit the toddler with a wild shot.

This vid presents a tough call in my book. If that were me, I don't think I would have fired unless he came behind the counter and demanded that we go to the back room or lay down. Give him the cash drawer and get him out of there.

All the money we owe China isn't worth the life of a child sitting on a counter, let alone what was in that cash drawer. Was he the owner of the business? Or was this money insured?

I REALLY didn't want to get into an argument in this forum, but flame away.


--

[hutch1999]

he said the angle of the vid made the child look closer than it actually was

[2000LS1Bird]

he said the angle of the vid made the child look closer than it actually was

That's still a risky call. Watching it with the child on the counter is what made it hard to swallow. But that's life. I wasn't there.

Maybe that guy would have fired a wild shot on the way out even if he had been given the cash drawer. Who knows.

I too, am sad that those three hits didn't kill the perp. Would have made the world a safer place.

[hutch1999]

for sure, you also can't rule out the perp killing or shooting everyone in the vid after he got the money. happens all the time. worthless people steal and hurt everyday.

[preston1980]

While I do not share in any argument that the "bad guy" was the victim in any sense, I still think the best way to handle that situation was to give him the money and let him leave as peacefully as possible. Many innocents bystanders could have been hurt, and that is not worth saving a couple hundred dollars or to make an example out of him. I would not have cared if the "bad guy" did die, he made the decision to do crime and put him self in the position to be killed. He deserves what he gets.

I think the clerk with the gun should have been ready and drawn if the man didn’t leave after he was handed the money. I think to often people with guns really want to and cant wait to use em, I hear of people chasing robbers down the street after they have stolen money from the company they work for. Here is my question: You work there, its not your money, its insured, why are you chasing after the robber? Its not to save people or even to save the money from being stolen, it is so you can be a hero or so you can use your weapon. Statistics will show that most robbers get the money and run away quickly with out hurting anyone.

That is often the case in the off duty police officer that gets into a shot out with a robber that stole $100 from a gas station. Its just like my argument that a cop should let someone go when they are running from a traffic stop for speeding. Too many people die or get hurt or get property damage from these high speed chases, when the cops could just CB ahead and set up a road block, or just get em later. I don’t think we should not chase people who run from cops, but use common since once it starts to endanger others, and let the risk of the chase be relative to the reason you are chasing them. If they murdered some one, chase em, if they ran a red light and don’t stop, let em go, but get the plate # and use technology to get em later.

[hutch1999]

Basically everyone would have been fine with the vid if it was just CCW guy. Well no one but the criminal was hurt so it makes it a successful use of force imo and I wouldn't have put it past the criminal to have shot someone after receiving the money. You can always say what it on so many different things.

[preston1980]

Basically everyone would have been fine with the vid if it was just CCW guy. Well no one but the criminal was hurt so it makes it a successful use of force imo and I wouldn't have put it past the criminal to have shot someone after receiving the money. You can always say what it on so many different things.

I do not think the ccw clerk should be in any trouble, and I am ok with the criminal dying, as long as the ccw clerk can live with it. Im glad noone was hurt (besides bad guy). I think the ccw clerk should learn from this and realize that he could have endangered others by his actions, and could have been in troulble if someone was hurt. If he still thinks it was the right thing to do, thats fine, I just disagree, in this particular scenerio.

And you are right in saying that the BG could have shot someone after wards, it could have happend, just usually doesnt. it is easy to say what if after wards, very true.

[hutch1999]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rysWX_WW89Y[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5cD7qv_OwIw[/ame]

[hutch1999]

just a couple vids where the worthless criminal shoots a clerk for no reason...

[Ed Blown Vert]

I just don't understand the mentality of wait for the criminal to shoot before reacting.
You can't shoot back if your dead. I am not taking that chance.

[Sarge]

While I do not share in any argument that the "bad guy" was the victim in any sense, I still think the best way to handle that situation was to give him the money and let him leave as peacefully as possible. Many innocents bystanders could have been hurt, and that is not worth saving a couple hundred dollars or to make an example out of him. I would not have cared if the "bad guy" did die, he made the decision to do crime and put him self in the position to be killed. He deserves what he gets.

I think the clerk with the gun should have been ready and drawn if the man didn’t leave after he was handed the money. I think to often people with guns really want to and cant wait to use em, I hear of people chasing robbers down the street after they have stolen money from the company they work for. Here is my question: You work there, its not your money, its insured, why are you chasing after the robber? Its not to save people or even to save the money from being stolen, it is so you can be a hero or so you can use your weapon. Statistics will show that most robbers get the money and run away quickly with out hurting anyone.

That is often the case in the off duty police officer that gets into a shot out with a robber that stole $100 from a gas station. Its just like my argument that a cop should let someone go when they are running from a traffic stop for speeding. Too many people die or get hurt or get property damage from these high speed chases, when the cops could just CB ahead and set up a road block, or just get em later. I don’t think we should not chase people who run from cops, but use common since once it starts to endanger others, and let the risk of the chase be relative to the reason you are chasing them. If they murdered some one, chase em, if they ran a red light and don’t stop, let em go, but get the plate # and use technology to get em later.

So if I embrace your rational.....I can break any traffic law and haul ass and nobody will chase me....I (by speeding and driving like an idiot) am endangering everybody but you advocate that is OK...but the Cops cannot chase me....walk me through that.....and do not say I will slow down and drive like Ms. Daisy if the Cops arent chasing me because that is not the real world case at all.....I can get a gun and rob anybody and nobody will shoot me because it is not worth stopping me.
Problem with this flawed thinking is ...many times the robber shoots folks for no reason....even those that cooperated.....happens all the time.....and your thought of CCW's "wanting to shoot somebody" is equally flawed....CCW folks commit far fewer crimes (statistically) than any other segment of the population. The police have no legal responsibility to protect you and cannot be held liable for not coming to your aid.....I carry a gun because I cannot carry a cop....I am responsible for my own well being....
The biggest flaw in your line of thought is the bad guy thinks like a normal person....that is a BIG mistake....most people that rob are higher than a kite on God knows what....They do not process data like normal people or they wouldnt be doing what they are doing....this is why many bad guys just start shooting everybody even when everybody did exactly what they were told......a bad guy comes in with a gun....your life is on the line along with everybody else in the store....you bet your ass I would kill him right there.....how much money is in play is of no relevance at all.
Liberals are in denial of all aspects of reality.

[SMWS6TA]

Liberals are called pussies down here in South Texas...we call them that for a reason....coward bastards....

Add Alabama, we have the same sentiment, Sarge

[dpinson]

while it is a tough call for me with a child so near,i still think the right thing was done

nobody but the bad guy was hurt and there is no way to prove that the bad guy would have not hurt anyone there

my props go to the clerk he handled himself and the gun like a champ


so for anyone that thinks he was wrong go stick it up your you know what


I can almost guarantee that the mom of the child was thankful that he did what he did. She like us would have no way of knowing what would have happened instead and the outcome was perfect so I know i would be pleased as a parent.


This incident probably kept a few people from being robbed because the bad guys start thinking twice after this type of thing happens.