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A/F and Timing

This is a discussion on A/F and Timing within the Nitrous forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; how much timing do i pull for a 100 and a 150 shot?...

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    A/F and Timing

    how much timing do i pull for a 100 and a 150 shot?
    Last edited by Drew01SS; 03-16-2009 at 05:47 PM.

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    Senior Member karpetcm's Avatar
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    its usually for every 50hp 2 degrees are pulled, ive comfirmed this with many people and thank god i did or else i wouldve blown my motor. Your car on motor will run like crap meaning it wont pull as much power as it did before on MOTOR unless you get a good ignition system which alows you to pull timing and advance timing when you like, i mean this with a wet system a dry system since you putting it in front of your MAF it automatically pulls timing but as to how much and is it safe dont know much about a dry system and im getting into that since i want to install it on my car. You will for sure have people tell you they did not do anything to there timing and there car runs fine, thats fine but i would not go that route what so ever since many people have blown there motor by not taking the correct steps in making the use of nitrous safe. Make sure you have the right plugs and send your computer out to get it tuned for nitrous if you dont want to buy a good ignition system for timing and spark. Also A/F is just as critical as timing so getting it on the dyno making sure you have good A/F is key and if you have a wet system id adjust that buy changing the fuel jets to get proper A/F while using nitrous.
    Last edited by karpetcm; 03-16-2009 at 07:16 PM.
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    thanks for the info, that seems like alot of timing to pull. Is there such a thing as pulling too much timing? I have a HSW nitrous controller and am currently pulling 1 degree for 100 shot. So I should be pulling 4 degrees? A/F is at 10-5 on wet shot

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    Senior Member karpetcm's Avatar
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    On many occasions ive heard people only pull 1 degree out for a 100 shot. The only thing i can suggest to you is at first do a 50 shot and pull 2 degrees out make sure its running properly at a small shot. Then up it slowly go to 75 and keep it at 2 if it starts to act up then pull 1 degree at a time. Dont get caught up into slapping it on and pulling 1 or 2 degrees and calling it a day, requires a bit of trial and error but if your doing trial and error make sure you start off small. I started at 50 shot and worked my way up and pulled timing as needed.

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    If your on the stock GM tune you don't need to pull ANY timing if your running the A/F ratio @ 10.5 for 100 shot.
    On 150 I would pull 2 if your running the band wagon NGK's.


    What plugs are you running?


    Stock fuel pump?
    Don't be afraid of the bottle!!! Be afraid of your tune!!!

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    Junior Member jakesz28's Avatar
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    A A/F ratio of 10.5 is a little rich no matter how much your spraying. I run my car at about the same A/F ratio spraying as I do on the motor. To much fuel with nitrous is hard on rings. With a small shot in the 100-200hp range you can get away easy. Timing is harder on a motor then being lean. Look at the people running 3 or 4 kits. Each kit is jetted leaner then the one before it. I also pull more timing then the 2 degrees per 50hp.

    If I was to pull 2 degrees per 50hp and spray 400hp that would be 16 degrees to pull. But my motor will make max power N/A at 35-38*. So by that rule I only need 20* timing. But that is about what I run on 250hp.
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    TunedbyFrost.com Tuner Frost's Avatar
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    I don't like 10.5:1 on a 150 shot. That's too fat and is hard on the rings as jake noted above. There is no reason to be fatter than mid 11s on that shot; just swap the jet. Don't worry about "pulling too much timing". This isn't FI, timing doesn't gain you a ton with the jug, it just gets you into a bind if you run too much.

    The only time the timing reduction is active is on the spray anyway, so it's not like making it safe is going to hurt you N/A.

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    AFR should be high 11's - low 12's. I'd start with 25* of timing for a 150 shot with 93 octane.

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    TunedbyFrost.com Tuner Frost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 02blkws6 View Post
    AFR should be high 11's - low 12's. I'd start with 25* of timing for a 150 shot with 93 octane.
    that's relative to the setup (the timing part I mean); I have tuned more than one 01-02 F-body (with stock cam and heads) that can't run more than 25-26 on the dynojet dyno I tune with, which means they can't even run that much on the street or track... and that's OFF the bottle.

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    Junior Member jakesz28's Avatar
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    I'm running less then then 25* timing on a 23* head. The LSx heads which are more efficent will need less timing then that on spray, depending on over all set-up.

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    Senior Member karpetcm's Avatar
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    Steve, so if i want to run a wet system and 150 shot should i send my computer back to you to take timing out and adjust A/F just wondering since im gonna put on a nitrous system very soon.

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    TunedbyFrost.com Tuner Frost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by karpetcm View Post
    Steve, so if i want to run a wet system and 150 shot should i send my computer back to you to take timing out and adjust A/F just wondering since im gonna put on a nitrous system very soon.
    You can...

    I use a $50 'module' that goes in the middle of your IAT connection (has factory plugs) and gets wired into your arming circuit. It basically lets you keep your full timing off the bottle and run different timing just at WOT on the spray. It works together with programming.

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    Senior Member karpetcm's Avatar
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    I had no idea you can do that, thats perfect. So basically when i engage the nitrous the module will cut back timing and when i shut the switch off it will go back to N/A tune ? So how do i do this Steve do i send you back my computer and you re tune it and send it back to me with the IAT sensor module or you just send the module out ? Thanks for getting back to me

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    TunedbyFrost.com Tuner Frost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by karpetcm View Post
    ... do i send you back my computer and you re tune it and send it back to me with the IAT sensor module....
    yessir.

    If the car was here, the module could be used to tune the fuel too only on the spray. It makes it nice tuning wet kits on the dyno and not having to swap jets or adjust the nozzle direction/placement for dry hits... It is very affordable for what you can do with it.

    It doesn't pull timing all the time when active either, it only pulls timing above about 90% throttle so it doesn't interfere with normal operation ANYWHERE.

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    Senior Member karpetcm's Avatar
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    Then ill be definitly sending it back to you for the tune, im gonna go wet system 150 shot. Just gonna change my plugs and call it a day. Thanks Steve for the info

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    yessir.

    If the car was here, the module could be used to tune the fuel too only on the spray. It makes it nice tuning wet kits on the dyno and not having to swap jets or adjust the nozzle direction/placement for dry hits... It is very affordable for what you can do with it.

    It doesn't pull timing all the time when active either, it only pulls timing above about 90% throttle so it doesn't interfere with normal operation ANYWHERE.

    Which "module" are you using? Im in the market for one.
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    TunedbyFrost.com Tuner Frost's Avatar
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    I make them.

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    Junior Member jakesz28's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    I make them.

    Can you send me a PM about that. I may want to look into that on another project I have.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    I make them.
    Very interested, could you give me some more info on them and pricing?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    I make them.
    pm me too?

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