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22-23 degrees and 125 shot

This is a discussion on 22-23 degrees and 125 shot within the Nitrous forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; I want to spray a 125 wet shot. (kit sitting in garage) My timing is at 22-23 degrees WOT. I'm ...

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    Member RealLiveMD's Avatar
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    22-23 degrees and 125 shot

    I want to spray a 125 wet shot. (kit sitting in garage) My timing is at 22-23 degrees WOT. I'm using a standalone with 110 I guess. my a/f ratio is 13.4/1 until 5100 then dives to about 12.8/1. This sounds like I should be able to spray a 125 shot without pulling timing. The car makes 400NA rwhp. What do you think?

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    Senior Member bills98ta's Avatar
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    Senior Member mrr23's Avatar
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    i normally run 25* timing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RealLiveMD View Post
    I want to spray a 125 wet shot. (kit sitting in garage) My timing is at 22-23 degrees WOT. I'm using a standalone with 110 I guess. my a/f ratio is 13.4/1 until 5100 then dives to about 12.8/1. This sounds like I should be able to spray a 125 shot without pulling timing. The car makes 400NA rwhp. What do you think?
    13.4 A/F?! isn't that a bit lean for a nitrous application?

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    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turrry View Post
    13.4 A/F?! isn't that a bit lean for a nitrous application?
    It's a bit lean for even a NA setup. I would rather see that 12.8 AFR accross the board,,,not just up top. If anything I like them a little richer toward the bottom of the rpm range where knock is more common.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebirdjones View Post
    It's a bit lean for even a NA setup. I would rather see that 12.8 AFR accross the board,,,not just up top. If anything I like them a little richer toward the bottom of the rpm range where knock is more common.
    I don't have any knock. I will gladly take it back to the tuner though. I was planning on taking it back before actually spraying. On the other hand, I've beat the hell out of it for 3 years without a hiccup. I'm assuming the 110 or c16 in my standalone should drop the a/f ratio to an acceptable range for nitrous.

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    better to start out "fat" and work backwards toward lean, always pull timing for the bottle 2 degrees for evry 50hp check the plugs for "peppering" and it will last for many miles

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    Senior Member mrr23's Avatar
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    2* per 50hp is too much retard. maybe above 200, but you can go with stock timing table on a 150 shot.

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    Member RealLiveMD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nitrusmike View Post
    better to start out "fat" and work backwards toward lean, always pull timing for the bottle 2 degrees for evry 50hp check the plugs for "peppering" and it will last for many miles
    If the stock timing table goes to 26 and I'm already at 23, why would I pull timing? Most people say stock timing is good for at least 100 shot, so, my measly 125 should be fine. Oh, yeah, I plan on being fat with the c16 or 110 in the standalone.

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    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    A 2002 F-body should have had a stock timing table of about 19 degrees. If you have 23 degrees in there, then I believe it's been tinkered with already.

    I'm pretty sure it was the earlier years (98-00) that had a higher timing table from the factory, something like 28 degrees???

    Mrr23 would know for sure.

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    Senior Member mrr23's Avatar
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    depending on where you are at in your timing table, you can be 27*-28*. most stock displacement LS1 motors typically are in the .52 - .60 cylinder airmass rows. here's screenshot of as stock 2002 high octane timing table. so, just make sure your timing is in the 22*-23* range there


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    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    I was hoping you would post up a timing table

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    Senior Member mrr23's Avatar
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    you were one minute ahead of me.

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    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    It's funny you mentioned the air mass rows Mrr23. My 2002 SS runs in the .72 air mass row consistently at WOT, with stock cam and all. Which is where I got the 19 degrees from,,,I had to bump that entire section up.

    Yet that 2000 I picked up in your neck of the woods with that Vinci cam, and now an LS6 intake and such,,,and it only runs in the .52 airmass area at WOT. Strange to me.

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    Member RealLiveMD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrr23 View Post
    depending on where you are at in your timing table, you can be 27*-28*. most stock displacement LS1 motors typically are in the .52 - .60 cylinder airmass rows. here's screenshot of as stock 2002 high octane timing table. so, just make sure your timing is in the 22*-23* range there

    Click for full size
    Ok now I'm all confused again. I had a friend plug in hptuners and I did WOT runs. while running, the computer read 22-23. I assumed that meant that my timing was at 22-23 at WOT which is where I'll be when spraying.

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    Senior Member mrr23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebirdjones View Post
    It's funny you mentioned the air mass rows Mrr23. My 2002 SS runs in the .72 air mass row consistently at WOT, with stock cam and all. Which is where I got the 19 degrees from,,,I had to bump that entire section up.

    Yet that 2000 I picked up in your neck of the woods with that Vinci cam, and now an LS6 intake and such,,,and it only runs in the .52 airmass area at WOT. Strange to me.
    airflow restrictions will dictate how much cylinder airmass will be used. example, if the 2000 still has the LS1 intake, it will pull in less air than the 2002 with the LS6 intake.

    Quote Originally Posted by RealLiveMD View Post
    Ok now I'm all confused again. I had a friend plug in hptuners and I did WOT runs. while running, the computer read 22-23. I assumed that meant that my timing was at 22-23 at WOT which is where I'll be when spraying.
    so long as you logged it and saw the timing, that's where you'll be. you'll want to check again when you do run the nitrous as it changes the cylinder airmass some. with nitrous, the motor rpms quicker and can result in higher cylinder airmass which will put you lower in the timing table.

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    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RealLiveMD View Post
    Ok now I'm all confused again. I had a friend plug in hptuners and I did WOT runs. while running, the computer read 22-23. I assumed that meant that my timing was at 22-23 at WOT which is where I'll be when spraying.
    Ya like Mrr23 said, it depends on what cylinder airmass row the engine is running in at WOT. You would have to log while watching the entire timing table and go on a full throttle run. Then tinker in and around that area.

    If you were showing 22-23 degrees on the main screen,,,then the car was probably running in the .72 to .76 cyl airmass area at WOT....

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    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrr23 View Post
    airflow restrictions will dictate how much cylinder airmass will be used. example, if the 2000 still has the LS1 intake, it will pull in less air than the 2002 with the LS6 intake.
    Ya that's along the lines I was thinking. I recently installed an LS6 intake, and with that baby cam I would think the cylinder airmass would have at least matched or went even higher than my stock 2002.
    I'm guessing it must be the difference in the cylinder heads,,,853's verses the 241's???

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    Senior Member mrr23's Avatar
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    could be. the 241s are supposed to flow more than the 853s. also camshaft LSA plays a role in cylinder airmass

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