Subaru STI Race.

[Cobra_Killer]

Alright, I have a 1999 SS, and this is a guy whom I work with and friends with, and ever since I got my car he has been hounding me to run my car against his. My car is all stock except for Headers, Exhaust, and a cut-out. He has a lot of stuff done to his, don't know what but, it's a lot quicker than a stock STI. So anyway we were hanging out at a local racing meet, and he says "Come on man, lets run tonight!" So I finally broke down, and said alright lets go. So anyway we went out to where we were racing, and I told him I defiantly wouldn't do from a dig since he is All-wheel drive. So I told him I would do 40-punch. So anyway we got in it, and the first race he took me by a half a car because I missed 3rd. But the second race was more on my side I took him by a car. He wanted to run again, and again I took him. So still pissed off he wanted to run again, so then again I made it even worse that time, i pulled him by about a car in a half. It was defiantly I good race, I went in totally thinking he was going to own me everytime, but I actually won. Maybe I should of bet him? :Owned:

[Wesman]

Nice kill.

STI's don't have shit for top end. They are only 230WHP stock, so they are a joke from anything other than a dig.

[5150]

Nice!

[Cobra_Killer]

and he was trying to say that he wasn't boosting at 40 in 2nd, when you could hear him boosting, he was trying to make excuses, cause of all that shit he talked before we raced.

[hutch1999]

you should have went from different mph rolls if he was bitching that wouldve shut him up fast, good kill

[jrc1122]

Nice runs--

I like the STI and EVO but I agree the LS1 has the edge stock vs stock (but just an edge)--

It isn't all about HP numbers- It is about how you get the power to the ground. The AWD systems in these cars do a great job of putting that power to to the ground. That is why the bust out sub 5 second 0-60s all day long.
From a roll, the LS1 has the advantage, from a Dig not so much--

[Hot Black Trans-Am]

Good kill! Sounds like you need a pro 5.0 shifter for you don't miss that 3rd gear.

[chieftransam]

I 2nd that pro 5.0. Good kill man. I know a guy that I work with that has the regular wrx and he talks a lot of smack. So we went out near I-95 and went from a 35-40 roll and I waisted him. I'm not stock and neither is he, but he still talks smack. I was pulling atleast 2 cars on him.

[Palli]

Good kill, can't stand those sti's.

[ss~zoso~ss]

from a dig a Ls1 would need radials or slicks, then it would have a shot from a dig assuming the rear didnt blow

[98T/Aformula.]

Good kill, STIs hold the road like crazy and would be a nice car but they are way over priced for what they are glad you shut him up !!!

[BlankinSShip]

Nice Kill!!!

I was in a similar situation not too long ago... I dont hear much about the STI anymore... HAHA

[Wesman]

Nice runs--

I like the STI and EVO but I agree the LS1 has the edge stock vs stock (but just an edge)--

It isn't all about HP numbers- It is about how you get the power to the ground. The AWD systems in these cars do a great job of putting that power to to the ground. That is why the bust out sub 5 second 0-60s all day long.
From a roll, the LS1 has the advantage, from a Dig not so much--

All you'd need are drag radials or slicks on the LS1 and its not even a race.

[jrc1122]

ok - whatever helps you sleep at night.

[Cobra_Killer]

Well he told me today, he wants to run from a dig since he "Did my race." now he wants his I guess. But I actually have a pair of E/T Streets at the house, just got to take them up to work and change them out, but I think thats a lot of shit to do to run him once.

[hutch1999]

Well he told me today, he wants to run from a dig since he "Did my race." now he wants his I guess. But I actually have a pair of E/T Streets at the house, just got to take them up to work and change them out, but I think thats a lot of shit to do to run him once.

I think it would be worth it, to whip his ass at "his race"

[Wesman]

ok - whatever helps you sleep at night.

Not my fault that you are ignorant and only look at magazine numbers :dunno:

[blue02Z]

Well he told me today, he wants to run from a dig since he "Did my race." now he wants his I guess. But I actually have a pair of E/T Streets at the house, just got to take them up to work and change them out, but I think thats a lot of shit to do to run him once.

if you hook on those et streets, you'll be in front by the end of 2nd i'd bet!!:slash:




i have a buddy who just bought a stock 04 sexually transmitted infection and he wants some of my car sooo bad! i cant wait till he gets it up here cuz i will destroy that thing:titslap:

[Wesman]

if you hook on those et streets, you'll be in front by the end of 2nd i'd bet!!:slash:

i have a buddy who just bought a stock 04 sexually transmitted infection and he wants some of my car sooo bad! i cant wait till he gets it up here cuz i will destroy that thing:titslap:

:thumbup:

[jrc1122]

Not my fault that you are ignorant and only look at magazine numbers :dunno:


A. I haven't picked up a Car mag in years
B. I have seen the numbers though-- they pretty much match what I have witnessed on the track and my buddies cars.
C. We get it-- you think they are all crap-- we know.. Yawn, it is old.

Lets move on-- Personally, I think Wesman should be banned from any thread about any car that has less than 8 cylinders, because you have the same rubber stamp response for every single post. IT is old, and unrealistic. I have seen Evos and STIs beat LS1 many of times, and I have seen it the other way around.

I never once said they were superior, I am just not so shallow or arrogant to believe that my car is completely superior in every aspect. Because it just
isn't true.


What's next-- I could say that the EVO/ STI is better in the snow, and you would probably argue that. Comical.

[Cobra_Killer]

if you hook on those et streets, you'll be in front by the end of 2nd i'd bet!!:slash:




i have a buddy who just bought a stock 04 sexually transmitted infection and he wants some of my car sooo bad! i cant wait till he gets it up here cuz i will destroy that thing:titslap:

Tell us how it goes. when it happens.

[Wesman]

A. I haven't picked up a Car mag in years
B. I have seen the numbers though-- they pretty much match what I have witnessed on the track and my buddies cars.
C. We get it-- you think they are all crap-- we know.. Yawn, it is old.

You are the only person who takes everything so personally. Get a life, nobody wants to hear you bitch and complain because you get offended when people bash your precious imports.

Lets move on-- Personally, I think Wesman should be banned from any thread about any car that has less than 8 cylinders, because you have the same rubber stamp response for every single post. IT is old, and unrealistic. I have seen Evos and STIs beat LS1 many of times, and I have seen it the other way around.

Nobody cares what you personally think, so it doesn't matter. If you love imports so much go somewhere else. It isn't that difficult of a concept, this isn't an import site.

I never once said they were superior, I am just not so shallow or arrogant to believe that my car is completely superior in every aspect. Because it just
isn't true.

Once again...your opinion. Nobody cares.

What's next-- I could say that the EVO/ STI is better in the snow, and you would probably argue that. Comical.

Evos and STIs suck in the snow with their stock performance tires. You'll get further with a FWD with all seasons then you will with an STI/Evo with summer tires.

[2MuchFun]

I beat a STi at muncie speedway by 3/10 of a second......I'm pretty much stock except shortthrow and K&N + free mods and spec 2 clutch. Sadly, no video proof, only got a video of spanking a 04 GT by a good second :itsok:

I honestly don't think he knew how to drive. (Sti)

[4G63inside]

Man.. you guys get all the good runs, I wish I could find a stock or near stock LS1 to run with around here. But regardless like it's been stated before about the AWD vs RWD if we'd go from a dig you'd have to run me down and come to the 1/4 near dead even being both cars are low 13, high 12's with a driver mod. But from a 40 roll or higher, the stock Evo's and STi's just don't have enough to run with an LS1. Plus with all STi's being a 6-spd. with such low gear ratio they are just constantly shifting.. It would get so annoying, that's why I'm glad my Evo's the 5spd.
And also just so everyone knows I'm not a troll, I posted in the "new to site" section with the title "sup guys" around 2 weeks ago explaining why I was here.

[Wesman]

Man.. you guys get all the good runs, I wish I could find a stock or near stock LS1 to run with around here. But regardless like it's been stated before about the AWD vs RWD if we'd go from a dig you'd have to run me down and come to the 1/4 near dead even being both cars are low 13, high 12's with a driver mod. But from a 40 roll or higher, the stock Evo's and STi's just don't have enough to run with an LS1. Plus with all STi's being a 6-spd. with such low gear ratio they are just constantly shifting.. It would get so annoying, that's why I'm glad my Evo's the 5spd.
And also just so everyone knows I'm not a troll, I posted in the "new to site" section with the title "sup guys" around 2 weeks ago explaining why I was here.

High 12's in an STi or Evo?? I don't think so.

All the ones I've seen at the track have run high 13's. You're only going to hit a low 13 if you can drive your car perfectly, if you don't launch it just right you won't be running any low 13 second magazine times.

[2000LS1Bird]

I'm lucky enough to own both an LS1 TA and a turbo Subaru Legacy GT. All I can say is that on the nice days, the Trans Am comes out of the garage!

On the rainy/cloudy/snow days, its all about the Subaru.

No comparing the two in a highway race, but 0-60 (typical stoplight encounters), they're pretty close.

Don't bash Subie, they're not rice. Subaru's are well made cars, with respectable power. Not like Honda, Hyundai or Toyota crapt. That STI should beat you 0-60, after that though your going to start reeling him in.

Kind of a pointless race really, there's little chance of you ever beating him off the line, even with DRs, and there's no chance for him to hold you off once the race hits the high mph numbers.

[Hot Black Trans-Am]

Most drivers of the awd cars I've ran into don't know how to launch them and bog them, so I usually get to kill them good from get go.

[Wesman]

I'm lucky enough to own both an LS1 TA and a turbo Subaru Legacy GT. All I can say is that on the nice days, the Trans Am comes out of the garage!

On the rainy/cloudy/snow days, its all about the Subaru.

No comparing the two in a highway race, but 0-60 (typical stoplight encounters), they're pretty close.

Don't bash Subie, they're not rice. Subaru's are well made cars, with respectable power. Not like Honda, Hyundai or Toyota crapt. That STI should beat you 0-60, after that though your going to start reeling him in.

Kind of a pointless race really, there's little chance of you ever beating him off the line, even with DRs, and there's no chance for him to hold you off once the race hits the high mph numbers.

If your Subaru Legacy GT is close to your Trans Am in ANY race there is something seriously wrong with your T/A.

[4G63inside]

High 12's in an STi or Evo?? I don't think so.

All the ones I've seen at the track have run high 13's. You're only going to hit a low 13 if you can drive your car perfectly, if you don't launch it just right you won't be running any low 13 second magazine times.


Well not to rain on your parade or anything but the fastest all stock Evo RS was a 12.65 @ 111mph I believe with a 1/4 tank of gas. I've ran a 12.85 @ 108 in my stock 8.. It's all about the driver and the 60' time, when it comes to getting the best time out of any car. As far as seeing most running high 13's.. anything above a 13.6 for a stock Evo with a 10.5 hotside (05 and up) in my book is basically terrible.

[Wesman]

Well not to rain on your parade or anything but the fastest all stock Evo RS was a 12.65 @ 111mph I believe with a 1/4 tank of gas. I've ran a 12.85 @ 108 in my stock 8.. It's all about the driver and the 60' time, when it comes to getting the best time out of any car. As far as seeing most running high 13's.. anything above a 13.6 for a stock Evo with a 10.5 hotside (05 and up) in my book is basically terrible.

Troll alert.

If you think anyone is going to believe those bullshit numbers than you must be on drugs.

You're honestly going to say that this Evo somehow gained 10MPH in 1/4 mile trap speed compared to every other stock Evo ever tested?? First off, the Evo RS has the same HP as ever other Evo (220-230WHP) and weighs 3219lbs. Its PHYSICALLY IMPOSSIBLE for the car to trap at 111MPH in stock form. Thats how its obvious that you are full of shit.

I've never seen a stock Evo run below a 13.5. Its just not common with average drivers. Most mag times (prepped track, professional driver) pull low 13's at 102MPH, which is about all the car is capable of. I also don't believe that you can a 12.85 @ 108 MPH in stock form, once again the car doesn't have enough power to hit 108MPH in the 1/4 in stock form, and a 12.8 is very uncommon.

I don't know whats so hard about the concept of Wheel Horsepower and weight that you ricers can't understand. With the stock power the car is putting to the wheels and the stock weight, the average driver will run a high 13 at about 100MPH. With a perfect, clutch frying launch and a perfect driver, low 13's are possible at around 102MPH. You're numbers just don't add up in any way, shape, or form.

[4G63inside]

With the stock power the car is putting to the wheels and the stock weight, the average driver will run a high 13 at about 100MPH. With a perfect, clutch frying launch and a perfect driver, low 13's are possible at around 102MPH. You're numbers just don't add up in any way, shape, or form.


Call me what you want.. but to get on point, your basically saying that the difference between a high 13 second car and a low 13 second car is only 2mph in trap speed? :thinkin: Your forgetting the 60' time as I mentioned in my previous post, along with the addition of the gear ratio. If you have the same identical car that on one run cuts a 1.6 60' and on the next run it does a 2.0 60'... your already 4 tenths of a second behind and trying to play catch up, which isn't going to happen because the cars in this example are identical, and 1.6 has the jump and already gaining speed vs. the 2.0. On the 2.0 run your ET & trap speed are going to be lower than the 1.6 run.. it's just simple math if you think about it.

But let's get back on topic, cause I'm not here to have a pissing match. Good run with the STi, keep us updated with any new runs. :D

[jimmybling31]

sti's are fun to run i have run one once. it was close. i pulled over 40 but up til then there was an advantage to the sti. gah i hate ricers though. they are so annoying. dude i know was trying to tell me that a stock 08 s2000 would walk all over my car without breaking a sweat. i told him to show me a stock s2000 that could do that and i would lick the spray paint on the hood of his civiv. lol.

[2000LS1Bird]

If your Subaru Legacy GT is close to your Trans Am in ANY race there is something seriously wrong with your T/A.

I'll chalk that up to your obviously lack of knowledge of the Subaru Legacy GT.

The mags say 0-60 in 5.9.

Its AWD, Manual Trans, and Turbocharged. In a 0-60 sprint, it IS close to my TA, or any other generally stock LS1. The Legacy runs a low 14 in the 1/4, so past 60, its not much of a race. But from a stoplight, it is.

[Hot Black Trans-Am]

sti's are fun to run i have run one once. it was close. i pulled over 40 but up til then there was an advantage to the sti. gah i hate ricers though. they are so annoying. dude i know was trying to tell me that a stock 08 s2000 would walk all over my car without breaking a sweat. i told him to show me a stock s2000 that could do that and i would lick the spray paint on the hood of his civiv. lol.


:haha: I had people tell me a S2000 could beat a C5 Vette. I had a 2002 S2000 and there's no way it could hang with my T/A except for a 40 - 70 race. Before and after that the car does not have much go to it.

[Wesman]

I'll chalk that up to your obviously lack of knowledge of the Subaru Legacy GT.

The mags say 0-60 in 5.9.

Its AWD, Manual Trans, and Turbocharged. In a 0-60 sprint, it IS close to my TA, or any other generally stock LS1. The Legacy runs a low 14 in the 1/4, so past 60, its not much of a race. But from a stoplight, it is.

Seems that you are the one with the lack of knowledge. LS1 F-bodies have been documented to run between 4.8 and 5.2 seconds 0-60. Thats an average of a full second faster than your Legacy GT - WITH the Legacy having an AWD launch.

Not only that, but there is no comparison in actual acceleration. Meaning without launching either car, it wouldn't even be a race. Factoring in drivetrain loss, you're Subaru is putting about 190HP to the wheels. The LS1 is putting ~300WHP down. Not only that, but the Legacy 2.5 GT weighs 3530lbs, which is more than an LS1 F-body.

So basically you're saying that your Legacy GT, which is down 110WHP and weighs almost 100lbs more, is just as fast 0-60 as your Trans Am.

Like I said, no offense, but something is seriously wrong with your car if the Legacy feels just as fast.

[2000LS1Bird]

Seems that you are the one with the lack of knowledge. LS1 F-bodies have been documented to run between 4.8 and 5.2 seconds 0-60. Thats an average of a full second faster than your Legacy GT - WITH the Legacy having an AWD launch.

Not only that, but there is no comparison in actual acceleration. Meaning without launching either car, it wouldn't even be a race. Factoring in drivetrain loss, you're Subaru is putting about 190HP to the wheels. The LS1 is putting ~300WHP down. Not only that, but the Legacy 2.5 GT weighs 3530lbs, which is more than an LS1 F-body.

So basically you're saying that your Legacy GT, which is down 110WHP and weighs almost 100lbs more, is just as fast 0-60 as your Trans Am.

Like I said, no offense, but something is seriously wrong with your car if the Legacy feels just as fast.

Just drop the "no offense" line of crapt already. You're clearly trying to pick on me, call my Trans Am slow, or otherwise put me down.

The '05 Legacy GT has a curb weight of 3300 lbs, right at what an A4 Trans Am weighs.

The Legacy has a final drive ratio of 4.11, my A4 Trans Am 2.73.

I've run both cars at my local 1/4 mile track, its in Tulsa, and its typically a slow track. The Legacy ran a 14.4 @96mph, the Trans Am a 13.5 @103mph.

However, although I've never lined them up together, 0-60 I still maintain they would be less than a carlength apart.

--

[jomo]

In racing it's not just wheel hp and weight. There is also grip and gearing. Just because someone does not have the same power their gearing makes up for it.

How many guys here went to 3.73 or 4.11 gears and drag raidals and how much of a difference at the track did you have? I bet you had a big difference.

Power is nothing without grip.

[Daz-E]

Please, someone post a video so he could see with his own eye's ! Apparently thats the only way he'll believe anything about STi's and Evo's. Besides, STi's and Evo's are not made for this kind of racing (though they do very well). Let see a LS1 around a track (wet or dry) against either vehicle or in the dirt/snow !

[Wesman]

Please, someone post a video so he could see with his own eye's ! Apparently thats the only way he'll believe anything about STi's and Evo's. Besides, STi's and Evo's are not made for this kind of racing (though they do very well). Let see a LS1 around a track (wet or dry) against either vehicle or in the dirt/snow !

Actually F-bodies handle damn well with a few suspension mods. Plenty of guys road race their LS1's, what are you trying to imply?? An LS1 with upgraded suspension and tires will easily handle just as well as an STi or Evo, it just takes some actual skill to drive it.

As for the dirt/snow?? Pointless to wreck a street car by doing that shit. If you want to go offroading, buy a damn truck.

[2000LS1Bird]

Its pretty easy to hydroplane an F-body as well.

Thats one reason why my Trans Am is never gonna see the rain. :)

[Daz-E]

I'm trying to imply that stock for stock the LS1 can't hang around a track with either car. But let make it even, lets see what'll happen if you mod an LS1 with suspension and an Evo or Sti with a gt35 w/meth and lets put them around a wet track .

Apparently you didn't know that rally cars can handle dirt and street and is not limited to basically a straight line.:burnout:

[Wesman]

I'm trying to imply that stock for stock the LS1 can't hang around a track with either car. But let make it even, lets see what'll happen if you mod an LS1 with suspension and an Evo or Sti with a gt35 w/meth and lets put them around a wet track .

Apparently you didn't know that rally cars can handle dirt and street and is not limited to basically a straight line.:burnout:

Right...:Poke:

Doing a few suspension upgrades to the LS1 will allow it to run with an STI or Evo on the track and kill it in the straights.

Where does the GT35R come in?? Who said anything about turning the Evo or STI into a turbo-lagging, unreliable, undriveable vehicle?? Because thats all the GT35 does. Not to mention the broken drivetrain components and blown up motors.

If you want to play the mod game, how about a H/C Supercharged LS1?? What now?? You could argue all say about gay 4 cylinders with turbos, in the end the LSX will always make more power, sound better, and be more driveable and reliable. Can't argue with physics.

[jrc1122]

LMAO-- these posts always make me laugh.


:sword:

[Daz-E]

LMAO-- these posts always make me laugh.


:sword:

Word ! ^^^^^

I was just simply saying that since you want to mod an LS1 why not make it even for the Evo an STi ! There's plent of STI's and Evo's w/gt35's that are plenty reliable.

Even with suspension mods it couldn't hang(especially the Evo)! Maybe in the straights it might catch up some ! But not if they had gt35's or similar turbo's .

[jrc1122]

Nobody cares what you personally think, so it doesn't matter. If you love imports so much go somewhere else. It isn't that difficult of a concept, this isn't an import site.

Love imports?-- I don't "love" any car. My life doesn't revolve around my car, and I feel sad for anyone who's life does.

I understand this isn't an import site, It is also not a Cobra Website- but people discuss that car quiet frequently.


Dude, you are so hateful, and so unpleasant to most everyone on this site that you disagree with.

Why don't you read every STI / EVO thread, and see what the popular opinion is of these cars.

You will find that an overwhelming majority of the people say the same thing, and respect the car for its performance. You will also find yourself on those posts, immediately using the words "garbage; trash, rice, etc.."

I personally don't like Gold Trans Ams-- but every time I see you post, I don't trash your car, and call it Mr Ts long lost ride, I don't say it looks like Flavor Flavs teeth. I don't say it looks like it belongs on a 80s model caprice, with twenty two inch 100 spoke daytons with spinner center cabs rollin' on hydros, bumping some old Master P in the trunk.

If I say anything, I would say it isn't my cup of tea.

Just because I don't like it, doesn't mean it can't be respected. After all it is still a nice car, no matter what color it is.

So the STI/ EVO,, well you might not like them.. But they still perform well especially 0-60 which is the typical stop light race..

[Hot Black Trans-Am]

My T/A has a stock motor and a few suspension mods and I can pull over 1G on turns with it so they can be made to handle well. I only ran a 0-60mph run on skinny 225/55/16 winter tires so far and I pulled a 4.8 with plenty of wheel spin. Once the roads are salt free and warm I'll do a run with good summer tires to see what I pull them. It should be a few tenths better than the 4.8 run. It was all measured with a G-Tech Pro SS meter.

I'm not taking sides just stating a few fact that I have so carry on fellas. :horse:

[Hot Black Trans-Am]

Its pretty easy to hydroplane an F-body as well.

Thats one reason why my Trans Am is never gonna see the rain. :)


Hydroplaning is all on tires and what your doing when your going through deep water. Water, rubber and road surface doesn't care what kind of car your driving. An awd will hydro just as nice as a rwd car. Cornering in wet turns is a different issue not hydroplaning.

[jrc1122]

My T/A has a stock motor and a few suspension mods and I can pull over 1G on turns with it so they can be made to handle well. I only ran a 0-60mph run on skinny 225/55/16 winter tires so far and I pulled a 4.8 with plenty of wheel spin. Once the roads are salt free and warm I'll do a run with good summer tires to see what I pull them. It should be a few tenths better than the 4.8 run. It was all measured with a G-Tech Pro SS meter.

I'm not taking sides just stating a few fact that I have so carry on fellas. :horse:


Nice times- Best I have managed thus far with a Beltronics FX2 = 5.01 0-60 mph.

I ended up selling the accellerometer, because i never really used it.
On a side note (back in the day, I owned this same model accellerometer and my buddy managed a 4.55 in his 03 EVO 8.)

[Hot Black Trans-Am]

Nice times- Best I have managed thus far with a Beltronics FX2 = 5.01 0-60 mph.

I ended up selling the accellerometer, because i never really used it.
On a side note (back in the day, I owned this same model accellerometer and my buddy managed a 4.55 in his 03 EVO 8.)

Thanks!

Every time I tried to get to run with the summer tires this last summer it didn't work out. Not very good roads around that are lightly traveled. I would really love to pull a 4.5 with mine. Was the EVO on stock power?

[Daz-E]

Yes ! Hydroplaning is possible in a AWD ! I did, in my STi(sold now!) on my way to work one raining morning, the curb put a nice tattoo on my left front rim and threw off my alignment.

Your Trans Am is Hot !

I am a car enthusiast ! Not just one car or type of car but many ! As much as like cars and all, in the end its just a car, basic transportation in most cases. JRC1122 has a point and I'd like to add, a car is not going to love you back if you say it does then you have issues !

[SuPeRmAn23]

hehe i like the way u said im mostly stock except for headers exhaust and a cutout...

[Hot Black Trans-Am]

Yes ! Hydroplaning is possible in a AWD ! I did, in my STi(sold now!) on my way to work one raining morning, the curb put a nice tattoo on my left front rim and threw off my alignment.

Your Trans Am is Hot !

I am a car enthusiast ! Not just one car or type of car but many ! As much as like cars and all, in the end its just a car, basic transportation in most cases. JRC1122 has a point and I'd like to add, a car is not going to love you back if you say it does then you have issues !

Thanks!

Same here, I'm also an enthusiast. There's many imports and other cars that I like and would love to drive for awhile. Every car has its strong points and weaknesses. I can find something to like for just about any performance car. :yup:

[Sleeper101]

HAHA I love this thread!!! Its the pick on WESASS thread!!

Does anyone live near this guy or ever personally talked with him?

He seems lonely :whip: You need to get laid man!!

[Sleeper101]

Here is you an all around video

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/757f8d3b-b1f8-4ccf-b4a0-9933014e165f.htm

[buswwa]

Right...:Poke:

Doing a few suspension upgrades to the LS1 will allow it to run with an STI or Evo on the track and kill it in the straights.

:lmao:

Let me ask you this, stock for stock, no mods, no difference from factory, will you beat an o4 cobra with your LS1? I know I wont. However the STi's I sell have and continue to do so. That is fact. I dont have the exact numbers on me, but Ill get them when I stop in work today.(the issue of Hot Rod's in my desk) Also, if your saying a suspension modded LS1 car can hang with an STi in handling, find a video of that. It wouldnt happen without at least 5 grand in suspension mods, and even then I doubt it. Have you ever rode or, drove an STi? If not you should.
I love my 99 z28, but I still respect what an STi is capable of. We lack the AWD to hang with these things. We lack the driver controlled center differential, and the front limited slip. Again, this is just a matter of a car that was originally built to run full bore in rally racing. Short quick bursts of speed, followed by an awe inspiring amount of handling Oh, and if we can mod suspension, it would seem only fair that the STi could. They can be upgraded too.

[shady milkman]

[QUOTE=Wesman;1312353]Right...:Poke:

Doing a few suspension upgrades to the LS1 will allow it to run with an STI or Evo on the track and kill it in the straights.

:lmao:


Let me ask you this, stock for stock, no mods, no difference from factory, will you beat an o4 cobra with your LS1? I know I wont. However the STi's I sell have and continue to do so. That is fact. I dont have the exact numbers on me, but Ill get them when I stop in work today.(the issue of Hot Rod's in my desk) Also, if your saying a suspension modded LS1 car can hang with an STi in handling, find a video of that. It wouldnt happen without at least 5 grand in suspension mods, and even then I doubt it. Have you ever rode or, drove an STi? If not you should.
I love my 99 z28, but I still respect what an STi is capable of. We lack the AWD to hang with these things. We lack the driver controlled center differential, and the front limited slip. Again, this is just a matter of a car that was originally built to run full bore in rally racing. Short quick bursts of speed, followed by an awe inspiring amount of handling Oh, and if we can mod suspension, it would seem only fair that the STi could. They can be upgraded too.


5 grand in suspension :faint: what the hell would you add for 5 grand...i have plans for a fully built suspension and its only going to be 2-3.5k

[TrickStang37]

Let me ask you this, stock for stock, no mods, no difference from factory, will you beat an o4 cobra with your LS1? I know I wont. However the STi's I sell have and continue to do so. That is fact. I dont have the exact numbers on me, but Ill get them when I stop in work today.(the issue of Hot Rod's in my desk) Also, if your saying a suspension modded LS1 car can hang with an STi in handling, find a video of that. It wouldnt happen without at least 5 grand in suspension mods, and even then I doubt it. Have you ever rode or, drove an STi? If not you should.
I love my 99 z28, but I still respect what an STi is capable of. We lack the AWD to hang with these things. We lack the driver controlled center differential, and the front limited slip. Again, this is just a matter of a car that was originally built to run full bore in rally racing. Short quick bursts of speed, followed by an awe inspiring amount of handling Oh, and if we can mod suspension, it would seem only fair that the STi could. They can be upgraded too.

PLEASE don't bring in the 03/04 Cobra. I just want to see the discussion sticking to STI vs LS1 fbody.

....

so, which is faster around a road course stock vs. stock? I dont care which will "hang in the twisties" better and which will "pull on the straights." I want to know which one is faster around the track, because a track will have both those elements.

[Daz-E]

Word !^^^^

[buswwa]

PLEASE don't bring in the 03/04 Cobra. I just want to see the discussion sticking to STI vs LS1 fbody.

Well, heres the correlation, an LS1 cannot beat an 04 cobra stock for stock. Also I dont have any magazines that pit it against the LS1 cars. Prolly too much of an age difference there. The STi beat the 04 Cobra, in the 1/4 mile, 13.30 @ 109 for the Termi, 13.29 @ 100.5 (both are altitude corrected):true::eek2::Owned:

....

so, which is faster around a road course stock vs. stock? I dont care which will "hang in the twisties" better and which will "pull on the straights." I want to know which one is faster around the track, because a track will have both those elements.
On the road course its a no brainer. but, Cobra pulled 1:22.7 seconds, and the STi pulled 1:21.0. And that was Hot Rod, Jan, 2004 issue. Ill scan it in and post the article if you want.:box:

[Wesman]

I personally don't like Gold Trans Ams-- but every time I see you post, I don't trash your car, and call it Mr Ts long lost ride, I don't say it looks like Flavor Flavs teeth. I don't say it looks like it belongs on a 80s model caprice, with twenty two inch 100 spoke daytons with spinner center cabs rollin' on hydros, bumping some old Master P in the trunk.

I don't like you. But you don't see me calling you names due to your sexual orientation, size, or the way you look. I can think of plenty of things that would apply to a person like you, but I don't say them.

[Wesman]

Let me ask you this, stock for stock, no mods, no difference from factory, will you beat an o4 cobra with your LS1? I know I wont. However the STi's I sell have and continue to do so.

No they don't. A 230WHP STI isn't going to beat a stock LS1, and its especially not going to beat a 380WHP Mustang Cobra. You are off the wall :Poke:

Also, if your saying a suspension modded LS1 car can hang with an STi in handling, find a video of that. It wouldnt happen without at least 5 grand in suspension mods, and even then I doubt it.

Yea, because nobody's ever road raced an F-body, they are only good for straight lines :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

You are ridiculous, 5K :jerkit:

Have you ever rode or, drove an STi? If not you should.

Yep. Not impressed. Slow as piss, terrible shifter, sounded like crap. Never will bother driving one of those riced up econocars again. Evo was even worse.

I love my 99 z28, but I still respect what an STi is capable of. We lack the AWD to hang with these things.

Right. A 9", slicks, and a 4K stall will never hang with an AWD STI :rolleyes:

We lack the driver controlled center differential, and the front limited slip.

Wow, I lie awake at night because I don't have a driver controlled center differential and front limted slip. Give me a fucking break, those are called GIMMICKS. They are toys, nothing more.

[Wesman]

Word ! ^^^^^

I was just simply saying that since you want to mod an LS1 why not make it even for the Evo an STi ! There's plent of STI's and Evo's w/gt35's that are plenty reliable.

Yea. Plenty reliable until the stock bottom end gives way, or you spin the bearings because on the crank because the shitty oil starvation issues that the 4G63 has under high g cornering.

Even with suspension mods it couldn't hang(especially the Evo)! Maybe in the straights it might catch up some ! But not if they had gt35's or similar turbo's .

With suspension mods an F-body could easily hang with an Evo. What the hell do you thinkan Evo is?? Its a damn Lancer economy car pile of shit, with all the suspension upgraded and a different engine. So if that can be made to handle well, the F-body chassis sure as hell can.

And if you're going to put a "GT35R" on the evo, might as well put 2 on the LS1. You know, even things up a bit.

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=861784

[Wesman]

Hydroplaning is all on tires and what your doing when your going through deep water. Water, rubber and road surface doesn't care what kind of car your driving. An awd will hydro just as nice as a rwd car. Cornering in wet turns is a different issue not hydroplaning.

Exactly. The type of car is irrelevent, hydroplaning is due to tires.

[Wesman]

HAHA I love this thread!!! Its the pick on WESASS thread!!

Does anyone live near this guy or ever personally talked with him?

He seems lonely :whip: You need to get laid man!!

Post reported. Irrelevent to the topic and inappropriate.

[jrc1122]

I don't like you. But you don't see me calling you names due to your sexual orientation, size, or the way you look. I can think of plenty of things that would apply to a person like you, but I don't say them.

Classy, and very upscale. lol

Okay, the difference is you don't know me or the answer to any of those things you seem to dislike about me. I do however know the color of you car.

Let's not start with 5th grade name calling. I stand by my point, because it is a valid one. What is next? Am I a "poo-poo head" lol.

Your personal attacks only proves you have lost in the arena of ideas and stoop to childish bantering to push your hatred of anything different than you or different than your car.

[Wesman]

Classy, and very upscale. lol

Okay, the difference is you don't know me or the answer to any of those things you seem to dislike about me. I do however know the color of you car.

Let's not start with 5th grade name calling. I stand by my point, because it is a valid one. What is next? Am I a "poo-poo head" lol.

Your personal attacks only proves you have lost in the arena of ideas and stoop to childish bantering to push your hatred of anything different than you or different than your car.

Personal attacks?? I don't personally attack anyone unless they start with me first, like you ALWAYS do. I state my opinion on something, I can back it up with facts, and you come in and personally attack me because you disgree.

Do everyone a favor and just stop posting. You have nothing to contribute, all you do is start an arguement and end up getting the thread completely off topic.

[jrc1122]

Personal attacks?? I don't personally attack anyone unless they start with me first, like you ALWAYS do. I state my opinion on something, I can back it up with facts, and you come in and personally attack me because you disgree.

Do everyone a favor and just stop posting. You have nothing to contribute, all you do is start an arguement and end up getting the thread completely off topic.

Naa Naa Na Boo Booo.. Stick you head in doo doo.. Now I feel like I have successfully matched your level of intellect.

LOL

:Ot:

[Wesman]

Naa Naa Na Boo Booo.. Stick you head in doo doo.. Now I feel like I have successfully matched your level of intellect.

LOL

:Ot:

Nope. You've just degraded yourself, again.

Like I said, its in everyone best interest (including your own) that you just stop posting now.

[jrc1122]

Nope. You've just degraded yourself, again.

Like I said, its in everyone best interest (including your own) that you just stop posting now.

I know I "degraded" myself-- It's called taking one for the team and stooping to your level for comic value. I'm sure 3rd parties completely understand what I am saying. You have made quite a name for yourself with your hateful, snide remarks. We all just snicker at them and move on.

Unlike you towards me, I don't personally dislike you. I just think your continuous bashing of the EVO/ STI types may stem from a deeper issue.
I am sure without much doubt that you the fun guy at the party to sit around and listen to your embellished rants on various topics. I bet it is quiet fun. To be completely honest, I am a little jealous that I am not so privileged to be in your presence during one of you live RICER rants. I am sure you are a hoot at the local bars. :cheers:


BUT....I take it, we wouldn't hang out if North East Fbodies did a meet. LOL-- After all I do live in PA, you live in NJ right.

and to stay on topic--

I think the STI is a nice car. Especially when modified. I prefer the evo to the STI, and I prefer the WS6 over both (obviously)-- because I have never owned an EVO, but I do own a WS6.

[Daz-E]

Yea. Plenty reliable until the stock bottom end gives way, or you spin the bearings because on the crank because the shitty oil starvation issues that the 4G63 has under high g cornering.



With suspension mods an F-body could easily hang with an Evo. What the hell do you thinkan Evo is?? Its a damn Lancer economy car pile of shit, with all the suspension upgraded and a different engine. So if that can be made to handle well, the F-body chassis sure as hell can.

And if you're going to put a "GT35R" on the evo, might as well put 2 on the LS1. You know, even things up a bit.

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=861784

Putting twin turbo on a vette does not even thing up ! Vette's are a different story because you don't have to add anything to it cause it can handle very well and can easily take out both Evo & STi on a course and in a straight line stock for stock ! We are talking F-body anyway which already has a hp advantage but thats it .

Though the Evo started as a Lancer the only thing it shares with the Lancer is the unibody.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lancer_Evolution

As far as reliability, you add a big turbo to any car and reliabilty is challenged and is up to your tuner to keep it within its limits. There's been plenty of LS1 to pop or spin a bearing without turbo. The 7 bolt 4G63's(95-99 Eclipse GST/GSX) had oil starvation problems.

I'm assuming you've raced or have a video of an F-body handling an Evo or STi on a road course ! I'm sorry not all cars are made equal, if an Lancer can be made to handle that doesn't mean a suspension modded F-body is going to be equal.

[buswwa]

No they don't. A 230WHP STI isn't going to beat a stock LS1, and its especially not going to beat a 380WHP Mustang Cobra. You are off the wall :Poke:

First, if your going to quote horsepower, do either both at the wheel, or both at the crank. At the crank the 04 Cobra is 390. At the crank the 04 STi is 300.

Yea, because nobody's ever road raced an F-body, they are only good for straight lines :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

Then dont you contradict your whole argument about them being able to hang with an STi in the turns right there? Oh, and tell that to the guys that run at (or ran I guess) at Limerock a year or two ago. There were 3rd, and 4th gens, as well as GTO's, and various other makes there. Also tell that to the guys that autocross thier 4th gens.
You are ridiculous, 5K :jerkit:

Fair enough, maybe 5 grand was a bit much.


Yep. Not impressed. Slow as piss, terrible shifter, sounded like crap. Never will bother driving one of those riced up econocars again. Evo was even worse.

Sounds like the same thing you say about any car made in another country. No surprises there. I have said nothing about Evos. I cant stand those things.
As for the shifter, triple cone synchros in first and second seem to engage nice and smooth. Dual cones for 3-4 are pretty tight too. 5-6 do leave a little to be desired, but out of 6 thats only two gears that arent as smooth to shift into. Sound is opinion, so I wont say anything about that. I will say they ride very hard, but those bridgestone potenzas arent exactly a soft compound tire.

Right. A 9", slicks, and a 4K stall will never hang with an AWD STI :rolleyes:

Ok, then how about a modded STi? Larger Intercooler, Cobb exhaust, some slicks. I didnt say larger turbo, but something has to equate for the stall, hence the intercooler.

Wow, I lie awake at night because I don't have a driver controlled center differential and front limted slip. Give me a fucking break, those are called GIMMICKS. They are toys, nothing more.

Calling those two items gimmicks simply explains how much you know about drivetrains other then rwd. Being able to set the torque split from 50-50 all the way to 90-10 makes a huge diff in handling. Front limited slip, well, that must be a gimmick, as just about every performance front drive car has one. Because uneducated performance car shoppers will just pony up without doing research first.

What you call toys, some people consider a pretty impressive car, for a Japanese 4 banger.

[buswwa]

Oh yeah, btw.....

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z8/buswwa/article/cover1.jpg

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z8/buswwa/article/page12.jpg

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z8/buswwa/article/page11.jpg

[Wesman]

Putting twin turbo on a vette does not even thing up ! Vette's are a different story because you don't have to add anything to it cause it can handle very well and can easily take out both Evo & STi on a course and in a straight line stock for stock ! We are talking F-body anyway which already has a hp advantage but thats it .

I was referring to the motor, not the car. in case you didn't notice, F-bodies and Vette's happen to use the same engine...:Poke:

Though the Evo started as a Lancer the only thing it shares with the Lancer is the unibody.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lancer_Evolution

Its the same damn car with nothing more than upgraded parts.

As far as reliability, you add a big turbo to any car and reliabilty is challenged and is up to your tuner to keep it within its limits. There's been plenty of LS1 to pop or spin a bearing without turbo. The 7 bolt 4G63's(95-99 Eclipse GST/GSX) had oil starvation problems.

Right here:

http://forums.evolutionm.net/showthread.php?t=188126

I'm assuming you've raced or have a video of an F-body handling an Evo or STi on a road course ! I'm sorry not all cars are made equal, if an Lancer can be made to handle that doesn't mean a suspension modded F-body is going to be equal.

The chassis is an econo car chassis thats been tweaked and upgraded. It was never designed for performance from the start, it was designed for a cheap compact car. The F-body chassis was designed for a sports car to begin with. Hence its rigid structure, SLA Strut front suspension, 3-link rear, and rearward engine placement for weight distribution. With the right handling upgrades it will easily keep pace with any Evo or STi.

[Wesman]

Oh yeah, btw.....

They obvious had some drive issues if the best they could pull out of a Cobra was 13.3. Look at the trap speeds, there's almost a 10MPH difference. Thats buslenghts in terms of distance from a roll.

Funny how everyone is so quick to quote the 0-60 and 1/4 mile times for the STI, but neglect to note that the trap speeds and 5-60 times suck. The car can sprint off the line because of AWD, punch it from a roll and its a complete dog. The actual acceleration isn't there, it won't put you back in the seat like the Cobra will. And thats the fun in owning fast car, actually going fast, not claiming the best numbers because you can launch with AWD.

[big hammer]

subaru sucks

[Wesman]

Calling those two items gimmicks simply explains how much you know about drivetrains other then rwd. Being able to set the torque split from 50-50 all the way to 90-10 makes a huge diff in handling. Front limited slip, well, that must be a gimmick, as just about every performance front drive car has one. Because uneducated performance car shoppers will just pony up without doing research first.

You are the ignorant one if you buy into that crap.

Do you see Porsche 911 Turbos with center differential setting toys?? No, because the car just does what its supposed to do automatically, without the need for driver input.

What you call toys, some people consider a pretty impressive car, for a Japanese 4 banger.

Some people do. I don't.

[buswwa]

They obvious had some drive issues if the best they could pull out of a Cobra was 13.3.
Yeah, the drivers for Hot Rod magazine needed the driver mod. Sure.
Look at the trap speeds, there's almost a 10MPH difference. Thats buslenghts in terms of distance from a roll.
Maybe it has to do with weight difference, and finla gear ratios. I dont know how they came in with those traps. They did sate in the article the best launch they could pull with the Cobra was a 2.25 60 foot due to stock tires. As far as that goes, we are talking about stock to stock. Im reasonable. Ill admit to the fact that Ive never driven the Cobra, so I dont know what its like to feel the supercharger kick in. From what Ive been reading, due to the linear power curve, it will throw you just about through the seat. Cool. I love that sudden push when the throttle is hammered.
Funny how everyone is so quick to quote the 0-60 and 1/4 mile times for the STI, but neglect to note that the trap speeds and 5-60 times suck.
As far as I understood, it only matters who wins the race. Trap speeds might suck, 5-60 roll, might suck (to you, as you dont like the way the car drives) but 1/4 mile is what I like to race. Cars get setup completely diff if they are just competing in 1/8 mile.

The car can sprint off the line because of AWD, punch it from a roll and its a complete dog. If it can sprint off the line, why wouldnt it be quick from a roll? Are you saying it jumps off the line and at 5 mph it has nothing left to give? I know from a 40 it's a whole nother story, but saying they cant run from 5 makes no sense from a mechanical/ physical sense. You'd still be in first, and in order to get the damn things to break loose, you have to hammer it from a dig, at around 4500-5000 rpms. If you go just below that, like 42-4300 rpms, it feels like your neck will snap fairly soon. The actual acceleration isn't there, it won't put you back in the seat like the Cobra will. And thats the fun in owning fast car, actually going fast, not claiming the best numbers because you can launch with AWD.
So your saying that only LS1s and Termies (or other v-8 rwd cars) will put you in the seat? I say the STi can throw you back in the seat plenty hard. 0-60 times in the STi are right around 4.2. I dont know what they are in the Termie. Fun is again, opinion. My sister used to think her 4 cyl geo metro was a blast to drive. Again, I love my Z, but regardless, the STi is a damn fast car. As for claiming numbers.... isnt that what everyone who likes fast cars does?

Oh, and on a completely diff topic, how do you break up quotes like that? Im sure my responses would be easier to read if I could do that.
Wesman, I want you to understand, Im not trying to be a dick, or start flame wars. Im just having conversatin as I would at work.

[JwMonE99]

Wow I cant belive there is a whole arguement on here about the STI, I am not even going to read the other pages, bottom line is there is no use for racing with an STI/EVO unless its some kinda rally race offroad (very popular in japan) it was not meant to race from a dig or a roll, so fuck all the AWD cars that do, RWD V8 is where its at bottom line. And as for that magazine article, they must of had some fucktard driving the cobra who cant launch a car with IRS but they decide to go with his time because they felt like degrading the cobra to make the "sti" more competable. (SP? if such word) so just leave it at this V8 RWD (either cobra or f-body) > STI/EVO toy cars

[buswwa]

Wow I cant belive there is a whole arguement on here about the STI, I am not even going to read the other pages, bottom line is there is no use for racing with an STI/EVO unless its some kinda rally race offroad (very popular in japan) it was not meant to race from a dig or a roll, so fuck all the AWD cars that do, RWD V8 is where its at bottom line. And as for that magazine article, they must of had some fucktard driving the cobra who cant launch a car with IRS but they decide to go with his time because they felt like degrading the cobra to make the "sti" more competable. (SP? if such word) so just leave it at this V8 RWD (either cobra or f-body) > STI/EVO toy cars

Wow. First, Rally racing is popular in Europe, as well as here in the states. It might not be nascar, or on Speed channel (Im not sure as I cant get get Speed with comcast. Bastards) but it is featured on ESPN (I dont know which of the 8 channels they have) pretty frequently.
Second. Do you think they dont launch when the rally races start? The difference is they have to run longer then the 1/4 mile.
Third. I get a kick out the fact that the magazine must have had a "fucktard" driving the Cobra cause it didnt win. You do know they run more then once, right? If it was Motor Trend, or Car and Driver, then I might agree about driver error. Not Hot Rod. Those guys drive gross h/p rwd all the time, and many are faster then the Cobra. Im sure they know how to launch a car properly, otherwise they probably wouldnt be driving for Hot Rod.
As for wether they are toy cars, thats an opinion. Again, I said nothing about the Evo.

[hutch1999]

03-04 Cobra SVT 0-60 4.5 sec & 1/4 in 12.9

Just throwing those numbers I found in. Continue the fight...

[buswwa]

It's not a fight. Just a discussion about cars. As for those numbers, where do they come from?

[hutch1999]

It's not a fight. Just a discussion about cars. As for those numbers, where do they come from?

It came from the ultimate bench racer internet gospel lol. Pretty good site.

http://www.albeedigital.com/supercoupe/articles/0-60times.html

[4G63inside]

I don't know where the #'s of a STi having only 230awhp came from.. but that's a little off man being totally honest. Just about all Evo's & STi's dyno in, in stock form between 260-265whp on a dynojet..
We aren't here to have a pissing contest or the foreign vs. domestic.. 4 banger vs. no replacement for displacement.
What we are doing is simply discussing in a civil manor (at least some of us) about cars in general.

Now let's state the facts between the stock Evo/STi & the LS1 (f-body)
1/4 mile: Basically it's a drivers race all stock, they're going to hit the finish nearly dead even.

5-60: There's no way to get around it, the only way the Evo or Sti will win is if (let say there's 3 honks) on the 2nd honk they press in the clutch rev to 5-6k and launch from a very low roll.. if it was just a 5mph punch, the LS1 would have a car length lead before either turbo 4 cylinder started building boost.

from a 40 roll: The LS1 will simply out pull the Evo or STi by around 2 cars to 100 depending if either the Evo/STi were brake boosting.. if not, it could be worse.

On the track: Whether it be a road course, twisties, auto-x... The Evo & STi win hands down. And yes I do agree, put a little money into the suspension and tires of the F-Body and it will corner with a STOCK Evo or STi.. Put some money in a simple tire up-grade on the Evo or STi.. and all the money spent on making the F-Body keep up with a STOCK Evo or STi, is now basically waisted.

But all in all, what all of us are basically doing is bench racing.. Cause if I had the money to do the tests for real facts I would in stock form.. Then up-grade one to catch the other in handling.. the up-grade the other to match them in power.. and go back and forth..
But like I just said.. all we're doing right now is bench racing.. plain and simple.

[Wesman]

I don't know where the #'s of a STi having only 230awhp came from.. but that's a little off man being totally honest. Just about all Evo's & STi's dyno in, in stock form between 260-265whp on a dynojet..

No, they don't put that much power down stock. Thats why they are almost dead even with 99-04 Mustang GT's and Dodge SRT-4's from a roll, because they all put down about 230WHP. Highest I've ever seen documented was 235WHP. Thats common for those cars. Factor in the drivetrain loss from AWD, and it comes out to around 230-240WHP. I don't know where you're pulling those numbers from.

Now let's state the facts between the stock Evo/STi & the LS1 (f-body)
1/4 mile: Basically it's a drivers race all stock, they're going to hit the finish nearly dead even.

Thats only if the STI or Evo get s PERFECT launch. Meaning a clutch frying, drivetrain abusive 6,000RPM clutch drop. Most people don't like replacing clutches as often as they change their oil, so most owners aren't gong to do that. So the STI and Evo have the capabilty to match the LS1 in 1/4 mile time, but only when pushed to their hardest. LS1's will run low 13's all day long by feathering the clutch off the line at 2500RPM.

from a 40 roll: The LS1 will simply out pull the Evo or STi by around 2 cars to 100 depending if either the Evo/STi were brake boosting.. if not, it could be worse.

2 cars...more like 2 buslenghts. We're talking about a 70WHP difference, thats considerable. The STI I raced on the highway from an 80MPH roll was in my rearview within a matter of seconds. They have NO top end power.

On the track: Whether it be a road course, twisties, auto-x... The Evo & STi win hands down. And yes I do agree, put a little money into the suspension and tires of the F-Body and it will corner with a STOCK Evo or STi.. Put some money in a simple tire up-grade on the Evo or STi.. and all the money spent on making the F-Body keep up with a STOCK Evo or STi, is now basically waisted.

Evos and STI's are already designed for handling from the factory, so any other handling mods aren't going to give the kind of results that they would by upgrading an F-body. Like I said, they are nothing more than econo sedan Lancers and Imprezas with handling upgrades. The F-body is a better chassis than either of those because its not derived from a cheap base model car, so with the right upgrades they will be just as quick around a track.

[buswwa]

It came from the ultimate bench racer internet gospel lol. Pretty good site.

http://www.albeedigital.com/supercoupe/articles/0-60times.html



Cool site. But feel free to check out the STi times, You'll notice they are almost the same as the Cobra. It has the Cobra running one hundreth of a second quicker in the 1/4 mile. And the LS1 times. shame they only go up to 98 w/LS1's though. Im sure the 00'-02's would be more impressive.

[buswwa]

I don't know where the #'s of a STi having only 230awhp came from.. but that's a little off man being totally honest. Just about all Evo's & STi's dyno in, in stock form between 260-265whp on a dynojet..


Now let's state the facts between the stock Evo/STi & the LS1 (f-body)
1/4 mile: Basically it's a drivers race all stock, they're going to hit the finish nearly dead even.

No, they dont.

5-60: There's no way to get around it, the only way the Evo or Sti will win is if (let say there's 3 honks) on the 2nd honk they press in the clutch rev to 5-6k and launch from a very low roll.. if it was just a 5mph punch, the LS1 would have a car length lead before either turbo 4 cylinder started building boost.

from a 40 roll: The LS1 will simply out pull the Evo or STi by around 2 cars to 100 depending if either the Evo/STi were brake boosting.. if not, it could be worse.

On the track: Whether it be a road course, twisties, auto-x... The Evo & STi win hands down. And yes I do agree, put a little money into the suspension and tires of the F-Body and it will corner with a STOCK Evo or STi.. Put some money in a simple tire up-grade on the Evo or STi.. and all the money spent on making the F-Body keep up with a STOCK Evo or STi, is now basically waisted.

But all in all, what all of us are basically doing is bench racing.. Cause if I had the money to do the tests for real facts I would in stock form.. Then up-grade one to catch the other in handling.. the up-grade the other to match them in power.. and go back and forth..
But like I just said.. all we're doing right now is bench racing.. plain and simple.

Heres the question about those horsepower numbers. How is the Evo only losing 10 horsepower from crank to tires? They only have 275 horse. The dealership I work at is Suburban Subaru. We have two other dealerships on the same lot. Suburban Kia (dont look at me like that. I dont work there) and Suburban Mitsubishi. I have driven both the STi and the Evo back to back multiple times. The Evo is a rattlebox. And that was an MR. It's the closest thing to the STi due to the 6 speed and the terrain selection device for the drivetrain. It's kinda like an overgrown TCS. However, when driving the Evo, you have to flog the shit out of it to avoid horrendous turbo lag. Turbo spools around 4-4500 and possibly even higher, its been about a year since we had one. I will admit they are rare. Doesnt make em good. They dont have the weight distribution to hang with an STi. Transverse mounted engine= High center of gravity= Body roll. It also equals torque steer. This was a family sedan that was upgraded to reach a target audience. And yes, so was the STi. The Impreza came out in 92 I think. However, subaru had been building awd cars for about 30 years when they introduced the Impreza. They always used the Boxer engine. Mitsubishi has gone through how many engine designs? Subaru symetrical AWD is rated as one the best made today. Mitsubishi has one AWD car. All Subarus are AWD. Who had the edge?
(dammit now I sound like a salesman......:hide:)

Now that is a book.

[4G63inside]

Mitsubishi introduced the 4G63 back in 1990 to 92.5 using the crankwalk prone 7-bolt, then from 92.5 to 98 using the up-graded 6-bolt motor. It has stayed the tried and true 4G63 motor with modifications and upgrades along the way, till this year with the introduction of the Evo X, now being a totally different engine, the 4B11 or something like that.
As far as there be a lot of turbo lag in the Evo vs. STi department let's look at something real quick.
2.0L with a decent sized turbo.. and I have no clue why your saying 4k rpms for boost on the stock turbo, a stock 2.0 motor with a GT35r turbo peak boost is achieved between 4500-5k rpms @ 23-25psi.
The STi, has a 2.5L block (in america, japan still uses the 2.0) and a tiny turbo compared to the 16G of the Evo.. More displacement + smaller turbo = minimal turbo lag... but on the same note, it runs out of breath at higher speeds.

The 03 & 04 Evo VIII's came with a 9.8" hot side and put out 271HP. The 05' and up Evo's came with a upgraded 10.5" hot side which resulted in 286HP, and now have the ACD (what you call the overgrown TCS) on all models, not just the MR. Also in 06' the IX was introduced with the MIVEC, with a more aggressive cam profile.. Which is why generally Evo IX's dyno higher #'s than the VIII's when the same mods due to the larger stock cam.

Both are great cars I was choosing between the two, but I chose the Evo due to the heritage of the 4g63 and the ease of getting power from the engine. But I love the sound of the STi with a turbo-back exhaust and tune.

I'm currently at work and can't post any links but sometime tomorrow I should be able to post some dyno #'s of both cars in stock form.

[JwMonE99]

Mitsubishi introduced the 4G63 back in 1990 to 92.5 using the crankwalk prone 7-bolt, then from 92.5 to 98 using the up-graded 6-bolt motor. It has stayed the tried and true 4G63 motor with modifications and upgrades along the way, till this year with the introduction of the Evo X, now being a totally different engine, the 4B11 or something like that.
As far as there be a lot of turbo lag in the Evo vs. STi department let's look at something real quick.
2.0L with a decent sized turbo.. and I have no clue why your saying 4k rpms for boost on the stock turbo, a stock 2.0 motor with a GT35r turbo peak boost is achieved between 4500-5k rpms @ 23-25psi.
The STi, has a 2.5L block (in america, japan still uses the 2.0) and a tiny turbo compared to the 16G of the Evo.. More displacement + smaller turbo = minimal turbo lag... but on the same note, it runs out of breath at higher speeds.

The 03 & 04 Evo VIII's came with a 9.8" hot side and put out 271HP. The 05' and up Evo's came with a upgraded 10.5" hot side which resulted in 286HP, and now have the ACD (what you call the overgrown TCS) on all models, not just the MR. Also in 06' the IX was introduced with the MIVEC, with a more aggressive cam profile.. Which is why generally Evo IX's dyno higher #'s than the VIII's when the same mods due to the larger stock cam.

Both are great cars I was choosing between the two, but I chose the Evo due to the heritage of the 4g63 and the ease of getting power from the engine. But I love the sound of the STi with a turbo-back exhaust and tune.

I'm currently at work and can't post any links but sometime tomorrow I should be able to post some dyno #'s of both cars in stock form.

Welcome aboard, I hope you stick around.

[2000LS1Bird]

subaru sucks

So does your mom! :blowme:

[2-bowties&abird]

:Popcorn:

[mrr23]

you bunch of whiners. can't just stay on the original topic. have to go and ruin the thread with your crap. move on, or get banned.