I'm a Oil Junkie

[Sarge]

That will not hurt your engine at all....

[GatorSS]

Thinking about going a little thicker next time to quiet things down...


So, it's louder after the switch to Amsoil?

I have not noticed any increase in engine noise since my change (about 1500 miles on Amsoil now). However, mine does sound slightly different, ...sounds "smoother" ...not quieter or louder, just different, like it's running easier. :dunno:
:hmm:

Sarge, what do you think?

[BlackHawk T/A]

So, it's louder after the switch to Amsoil?

I have not noticed any increase in engine noise since my change (about 1500 miles on Amsoil now). However, mine does sound slightly different, ...sounds "smoother" ...not quieter or louder, just different, like it's running easier. :dunno:
:hmm:

Sarge, what do you think?
Yes its louder, more piston slap. Obviously that's going to happen, because I went from a 10-30 dino oil to a slippery 0-30 full synthetic.

[Sarge]

Some LS1's will get "louder" with synthetics as sludge varnish etc. melt away with the cleaning agents found in high quality synthetics....the Amsoil 0-30 is thicker than dino 10-30 I'll share that for sure thing....different motors with different wear patterns sound different.....my LS1 at idle with all the goodies on her sounds like a Ford 350 diesel....gawd it sounds great.....at WOT she roars.....puttin around town she sounds like clickty clack thumpa thumpa bang bang.....

[Hi-Po]

Did you know...... synthetic never goes bad.. drain oil and put into glass container and set out in sun for a couple hours and everything that has collected in oil will float to top. use over and over again. (:

[Sarge]

You first.....you sayin gthe TBN's regenerate?
Ahhhh....your BS'ing the ol Sarge:)

[PaganEgyptian]

I only use a hydrocracked 5W20. I have tested Mobil 7500 5W20 in it with WIX filters, car seems to like it so far. I tried Castrol once, and never again. I didnt like what I saw when I drained it 1000 miles later. with 2500-3000 mile changes, Heads are clean as a whistle and look brand new at
110K miles. -Tim

[GatorSS]

Yes its louder, more piston slap. Obviously that's going to happen, because I went from a 10-30 dino oil to a slippery 0-30 full synthetic.
Oh, I forgot you switched from dino. :sillyme: I was thinking you were running a different synthetic like I was. I switched from Mobil 1 0-40 to the Amsoil 0-30.

Well, my engine has always had kinda like a low volume "tickity tickity tac tic tickity..." sound at idle. Now, it still has about the same volume of sound, but just a little different sorta rhythm.

[fredg369]

Just changed out......Mobil 1 european formula (what ever that means).....added Valvoline Syn power......Purolator filter......Feels nice and smooth running.
I love that feeling after an oil change.

[Sarge]

Good man. Long live folks with a brain.....and a well lubed LS1:)

[PaganEgyptian]

No Love for the Sixpack crew I guess. :cry: -Tim

[GatorSS]

Just changed out......Mobil 1 european formula (what ever that means).....added Valvoline Syn power......Purolator filter......Feels nice and smooth running.
I love that feeling after an oil change.
Ooooohhh! What a feeling! Like a junkie with a fresh fix. :cool2:

[Dantees]

Did anyone ever see that episode of Horse Power Tv where they have a 4th gen camaro SS and they put synthetic motor oil, synthetic transmition fluid, and synthetic gear oil, and they gain like 10 HP from doing this?

[GatorSS]

:no: I haven't seen it. What brand of synthetic did they use?

[Dantees]

I cant remember what brand they used, ill see if I can catch a repeat, they always show reruns of that show saturday morning on spike tv.

[Dantees]

they used royal purple the video is at their website.

[GatorSS]

Interesting...I've heard it is good stuff, but I've never used it.

[Tobynine9]

I had a really bad metal rattle also...and guess what it was...


c'mon guess.....


the o2 sensors...the stock ones have a metal ring at the beginning of the wiring...the damn things were rattleing against the bottom on the o2 sensor:brick: I replaced all 4 with bosch 02's and it's quiet as a mofo now...some people think bosch o2's are shit but their half the price as the dealer ones and they work great so far :think:

Is that what that is?? I was laying next to the car banging on my y-pipe trying to figure out where that rattle was coming from but I couldn't see much with out jacking/lifting it.

Amsoil sounds like an elixir fit for divinity as much as y'all are talking it up. If it weren't so doggone expensive I'd be ordering a case tonight. Sarge, am I reading your posts correctly that you say synthetic Castrol 0-30 is second best? It's hard to... follow where you're... going sometimes with all the... everywhere...

Seems there's a lot of us in S TX.

[GatorSS]

Sarge is on sabbatical.

[Tobynine9]

Sad.

[GatorSS]

Sarge is back. Maybe he'll answer you soon. :dunno:

[Sarge]

Is that what that is?? I was laying next to the car banging on my y-pipe trying to figure out where that rattle was coming from but I couldn't see much with out jacking/lifting it.

Amsoil sounds like an elixir fit for divinity as much as y'all are talking it up. If it weren't so doggone expensive I'd be ordering a case tonight. Sarge, am I reading your posts correctly that you say synthetic Castrol 0-30 is second best? It's hard to... follow where you're... going sometimes with all the... everywhere...

Seems there's a lot of us in S TX.
Sorry did not see your post. I'm old and feeble:)
I shouldn't "rank" oils....as one may be a better fit for one persons mods/geographical conditions and driving habits and another may be better for a different set of circumstances....German Castrol 0-30 and Amsoil are top quality oils for sure....German Castrol 05 mixes are not the same and the jury is still out on this "new" formulation...also availablity of the 04/03/02 versions are dwindling to the point of extinction.....Amsoil will deliver to your doorstep....that should be taken into consideration also....

[02z28ls1]

Did anyone ever see that episode of Horse Power Tv where they have a 4th gen camaro SS and they put synthetic motor oil, synthetic transmition fluid, and synthetic gear oil, and they gain like 10 HP from doing this?
Yes I've seen this and other tests like this in magazines and TV-it's true.The reduction in friction is amazing-but I'm more impressed with the longevity issues also.Any quality synthetic can give these results,not just royal purple,and they do seem to have a quality product.

[GatorSS]

....German Castrol 05 mixes are not the same and the jury is still out on this "new" formulation...
From what I've heard, :thumbdn: on the new German Castrol '05 mixes.

[Tobynine9]

What happened to SRV and the Goat?

[Sarge]

What happened to SRV and the Goat?
They'll be back:):usa:

[sonnyred]

This story dates back to 1986 when i flew model airplanes with gasoline engines. The usual mix with regular 2 stroke engines was 4 ounces of 2 stroke oil per gallon of gasoline.T hen amsoil came out and we were able to mix 1 ounce to a gallon.Now thats lubricatoin.Those engines ran hot as hell whith no ill effects and less mess.

[Zboner]

oil is so overrated

[Sarge]

STFU Zboner...big people are talkinig here.....
now I know why your ride is burnt up all the time:)
Hahahahahaha

[Zboner]

haha,i had to say that.

[Tobynine9]

It's sad to see such a well-informed man lose his mind in anger and senility.

[Bowtie Guy]

Guys,be nice---its Christmas!

[GatorSS]

oil is so overrated
Interesting quote from a guy with how many blown engines to his credit? Kinda reminds me of a woman I met years ago with engine trouble on a car several years old. To the question, "When was the last time you chaged your oil?" she responded, "You mean you're supposed to change it? I thought you only needed to add some if it gets low."

[Fastcar]

Hey Sarge;

While I am shopping for oils what would be the best fluid for my tranny and rear end? Was looking at the Mobil 1 Syn Dex III and hadn't found one for the rear end yet.

The only reason I am changing the fluid in the rear end is because after the military shipped my car over here the rear end started to leak, but not enough to drip yet. It has fluid all over the place and this weekend I am going to wash it off and see if the fluid shows back up.

Had my rear pinion seal replaced - GM now markets a fully synthetic rear diff. fluid with a "grape" smell (??? don't know why, mebbe gears run more smoothly if the fluid smells purty - NOT! :)). Don't know who makes it for them; my mechanic gave me a bottle of it for top-off if I needed it.

[Sarge]

On this GM rear end fluid debate/discussion.....No...I cannot provide chemical breakdowns and analysis...but I can tell you on the GTO...Royal Purple is the bee's knee's.....Amsoil on many occasions didn't allow the posi to engage and I was frying one tire many times.....the stock GM stuff really struggled with engaging the posi....now with Royal Purple I'm a dual tire smoking SOB....and it sure is quiet back there:)

[Zboner]

i have never blown an engine in fact, the dealer installed a junk engine before i bought the car, nothing was wrong with the engine at all. it was my choice to have it rebuilt:lol: , i change my oil every 3k, as long as you keep it changed every 3k you will be fine

[Sarge]

Just got my latest UOA back....the Shell Rotella 15-40 is doing a GREAT JOB.....
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/sgtgeek/UOAS.jpg
The actual report....
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/sgtgeek/UOA12-05.jpg
I am going to continue "tweaking"...we wanted to raise the moly and see what effect that has on the copper (bearings)....the lead dropped like a rock.....that is good....
We have a soup of 5 quarts Chevron Delo 15-40/2 quarts Amsoil 15-40 and 8 oz's of Valvoline Synpower Oil Treatment in right now.....big shot of Moly and Boron...so we will see.....
EDIT...just occured to me some folks may not know what these metals represent....so here is my "cheat sheet":)
Aluminum : Pistons, bearings, cases (heads & blocks).
Chromium: Rings, a trace element in steel.
Iron : Cylinders, rotating shafts, the valve train, and any steel part sharing the oil.
Copper: Brass or bronze parts, copper bushings, bearings, oil coolers, also an additive in some gasoline engine oils.
Lead: Bearings.
Tin: Bearings, bronze parts, piston coatings.
Molybdenum : Anti-wear additive, coating on some new rings
(washes off as break-in occurs).
Nickel: Trace element in steel.
Manganese : Trace element, additive in gasoline.
Silver: Trace element.
Titanium: Trace element.
Potassium : Antifreeze inhibitor, additive in some oil types.
Boron: Detergent/dispersant additive, antifreeze inhibitors.
Silicon : Airborne dirt, sealers, gaskets, antifreeze inhibitors.
Sodium: Antifreeze inhibitors, additive in some gasoline engine oils.
Calcium : Detergent/dispersant additive.
Magnesium: Detergent/dispersant additive.
Phosphorus: Anti-wear additive.
Zinc: Anti-wear additive.
Barium : Detergent/dispersant additive.

[GatorSS]

i have never blown an engine in fact, the dealer installed a junk engine before i bought the car, nothing was wrong with the engine at all. it was my choice to have it rebuilt:lol: , i change my oil every 3k, as long as you keep it changed every 3k you will be fine
I was just kiddin' with you in my earlier post... but if the dealer installed a junk engine, how could there be nothing wrong with it at all? :thinkin: I hope you didn't have the dealer that installed the junk engine do the rebuild.

I imagine it would be very hard to blow an engine; I've never tried and never will, but it seems like you would burn your lips on the exhaust tip while trying to do so.:dunno:

[GatorSS]

Sarge, nice work on your soup recipes.

[sonnyred]

I was just kiddin' with you in my earlier post... but if the dealer installed a junk engine, how could there be nothing wrong with it at all? :thinkin: I hope you didn't have the dealer that installed the junk engine do the rebuild.

I imagine it would be very hard to blow an engine; I've never tried and never will, but it seems like you would burn your lips on the exhaust tip while trying to do so.:dunno:

wow at least third degree burns which means no p---y kissin.

[Brianss1]

What would be the next thicker oil up from amsoil 5-w-40,for hot driving,not concerned about cold start up.

[Sarge]

What would be the next thicker oil up from amsoil 5-w-40,for hot driving,not concerned about cold start up.
Well oils are rated depending on pour point a various degrees...cSt@XXc....then we have the HTHS...these are the film thickness and pour point factors......so....you can have a XX-40 weight...and various oils will really be like a XX-40/41/42/43 etc. up to an XX-49...same with the 30 wieght so on and so forth.....
So Amsoil 5-40 has a cSt@100c of 14.5
HTHS of 4.2
If you want a "thicker" oil look at say (I'll stay with synthetics as that is the flavor you are wanting to compare)....
Castrol SynTec (Synthetic Blend) 10-40 cSt@100c of 15.9
Pennzoil High Mileage (Blend again) 10-40 15.5
RedLine 10-40 is 15.3
...So any of the above mentioned oils are thicker than Amsoil 5-40.....

[Brianss1]

Wow now that is some good info.So not all 40 weight's are the same as well as 30 and 50 weight.I noticed that all the oils you posted are 10-40 and not 5-40 does that have a play in the thicker oil ? When an oil get hot the first number means nothing ? I am I correct ?

[Zboner]

I was just kiddin' with you in my earlier post... but if the dealer installed a junk engine, how could there be nothing wrong with it at all? :thinkin: I hope you didn't have the dealer that installed the junk engine do the rebuild.

I imagine it would be very hard to blow an engine; I've never tried and never will, but it seems like you would burn your lips on the exhaust tip while trying to do so.:dunno:

cause one the salses man that sold it to WAS a family friend of 50 years and we thought we trusted him, when he said it was new, they cleaned it up really good, it started to make a lot of vibrations and then i got worried about it

[Sarge]

cause one the salses man that sold it to WAS a family friend of 50 years and we thought we trusted him, when he said it was new, they cleaned it up really good, it started to make a lot of vibrations and then i got worried about it
STFU Zboner you lil shit...big people are talking here....

[Sarge]

Wow now that is some good info.So not all 40 weight's are the same as well as 30 and 50 weight.I noticed that all the oils you posted are 10-40 and not 5-40 does that have a play in the thicker oil ? When an oil get hot the first number means nothing ? I am I correct ?
Don't get too caught up in the first number....a 10 weight is flowing at like 35 below zero....a 5 weight is flowing at like 45 below zero...so forth.....
your looking for operating temp thickness....or the top number....once again....an oil like 0-30 Amsoil is thicker than most (if not all) 10-30's.....just flows better at start up.....I highly recommend 0-30 Amsoil for a stock (or near too it) LS1......
Now if you wanna stay in the 5-40 range....Amsoil 5-40 is thicker than Mobil 1 Truck and SUV 5-40......I would recommend a 15-40 Shell Rotella or Chevron Delo 15-40......for our LS1's under the right conditions.....
Not to get absurd here....but 5-40 Mobil 1 turns to a low 30 weight after a few hundred miles...then builds it's viscosity back to the 40 weight range after a few 1000 miles per many UOA's.....
What is it your after and why?
STFU Zboner by the way.....go play on your BigWheel and STFU....

[Brianss1]

Just trying to educate my self here and maybe learn something even though its tough to do sometimes.I am running 5-w-40 amsoil right now,because I know the mobil 1 that is recomended is a little to thin.Sarge what do you sell or make this stuff everyday ?

[LS1-450]

Just got my latest UOA back....the Shell Rotella 15-40 is doing a GREAT JOB.....

We have a soup of 5 quarts Chevron Delo 15-40/2 quarts Amsoil 15-40 and 8 oz's of Valvoline Synpower Oil Treatment in right now.....big shot of Moly and Boron...so we will see.....

Sarge,

Are you looking for the best overall protection mix or a good racing/high rev mix? Am asking what motivated your research?

I have been using GC 0W-30 mixed w/ 6oz. of VSOT w/ good results. However, it looks like the Shell or Chevron 15W-40 offers good protection that can only get better while using VSOT. Your testing is done in the LS1 engine correct?

Pretty cool stuff.

[Sarge]

Just trying to educate my self here and maybe learn something even though its tough to do sometimes.I am running 5-w-40 amsoil right now,because I know the mobil 1 that is recomended is a little to thin.Sarge what do you sell or make this stuff everyday ?
I learned awhile back that engine oil plays a significant role in performance....much more than I ever dreamed....we all knew engine oil had "protection" and "longevity" impacts on our old hotrods...but some guy was putting Castor Bean Oil in his race car and as a young gun that just blew me away....I have been "learning" researching ever since....Not sure what your last sentence is saying.....I don't sell nothing to nobody.....

[Sarge]

Sarge,

Are you looking for the best overall protection mix or a good racing/high rev mix? Am asking what motivated your research?

I have been using GC 0W-30 mixed w/ 6oz. of VSOT w/ good results. However, it looks like the Shell or Chevron 15W-40 offers good protection that can only get better while using VSOT. Your testing is done in the LS1 engine correct?

Pretty cool stuff.
I want it all man......protection and performance.....yes I love that VSOT man.....I didn't have any in lately but right now I have 5 quarts Chevron Delo 15-40/2 quarts Amsoil 15-40 and 8 ounces of VSOT for a good shot of Moly and Boron man.....we'll see what the lab has to say about that soup ....yes I am running a modified LS1.....
What we fall into so often is the thin versus thick wars......Thin oil increases performance and thick increases protection.....in the middle is your "perfect" blend...only UOA's are gonna get you there.....A stock LS1 will do plenty fine with GC or Amsoil 0-30 for 99% of the drivers out there....start modding/racing and you need a thicker oil.....the HDEO (diesel) oils have a highly attractive add pack that you cannot find in "gasoline engine" oils.....so I am running some real world test and verifying butt dyno with lab results.....
It gives me something to do:)

[Brianss1]

From your knowledge on oils I thought you might work in that field like a resercher/developer or salesman for a company that's all I meant.My car has a big stall converter and is built up with a cam and head package so it runs a little harder then a stock car so I just want to learn more about what makes oils thicker and last longer and burn better in engines that are under more pressure.

[Sarge]

Good man....no I wasn't offended (that would be impossible:))...just did not know what you meant.....Yup...my LS1 is a heads/cam/nitrous/3200 Stall etc. etc. car.....the "normal 30 weights just dont get er done.....

[Bowtie Guy]

OK Lets continue the discussion. We have beaten viscosity to death and I think I know what to look for. Now please educate me on friction modifiers. Moly and Boron for instance. I think we are looking for a lubricant that holds its viscosity and is "slippery" as it can get. Right? Is the only way to get percentages of F/Ms is to do a VOA? They are probably trade secrets or some other BS. Whaddaya think?

[Sarge]

Ok....Good comment and question.....Let me cut and paste and excellent summary I keep....to start with...
Here is a comprehensive list (best you'll find outside of the lab) of multifunctional additives and their functions. Notice the same chemicals and compounds perform more than one function.


Multifunctional Additives (in Alphabetical Order) listed as to Functional Agent, additive category, general or specific chemical compound, and how it works, respectively.

Antifoamants or foam inhibitors (Protective Additive): polymers such as silicone polymers and organic copolymers of the silaxane's; creates a lens that reduces the bubble's surface tension.

Antioxidants or oxidation inhibitors (Protective Additive): ZDDP, ZTDC, Moly TDC, Antimony TDC, aromatic amines such as organic tolutriazoles, thiadiazoles, diphenylamines, olefin sulfides, carboxylic acids; decomposes peroxides and terminates free radical reactions. Increases temperature of base oil at which base oil may tend to oxidize. Oxidation of oil promotes polymerization of sludge particles and increases viscosity.

Anti-Wear and Extreme Pressure Additives (Surface Protective Additive):
ZDDP, ZTDC, Moly TDC, Antimony TDC, Organic Sulfur-Phosphorus-Nitrogen compounds, Borates and Borate Esters, Tricresyl Phosphates, amine phostphates, and other phosphate esters, Chlorine compounds, and lead diamylcarbamates, lead and barium naphthenates, sulfurized olefins; protective film interacts at various temperatures and pressures to provide either a plastic interface or to provide a compound which shears at the surface.

Demulsifier (Performance Additive): hydroxyalkyl carboxylic esters, alkenlycarboxylic esters; keeps water separated from lubricant.

Detergents (Surface Protective Additive): metallo-organic compounds of sodium, calcium, magnesium, boron phenolates, phosphates and sulfonates such as alkylbenzene sulfonic acids, alkylphenol sulfides, alkylsalacyclic acids; Lift deposits from surfaces to keep them suspended.

Dispersants (Surface Protective Additive): Alkylsuccinimides, alkylsuccinic esters (alkenyl succinimides); chemical reaction with sludge and varnish precursors to keep them acid neutralized and to keep them soluble. Detergent-dispersants often are the same chemical or come in compounds to accomplish the combined function(s).

Emulsifiers (Protective Additive): Polyisobutylenesuccinimides, alkenylsuccinate ester/salts. polyester amides, alkyl aminoesters; promotes a stable emulsion or mixture of oil and water.

Friction Modifiers or Friction Reducers (Performance Additive): Organic fatty acids and amides, lard oil, high molecular weight organic phosphorus and phosphoric acid esters such as Tricresyl Phosphates, ZDDP, ZTDC, Moly TDC, Antimony TDC, family of diphenylamines and amides, and olefin sulfides. Reduces coefficient of friction formulated lubricant in the boundary lubrication regime. Some VII's also provide friction reduction.

Metal Deactivator (Protective Additive): ZDDP, ZTDC, Moly TDC, Antimony TDC, family of diphenylamines and amides, and olefin sulfides, heterocyclic sulfur-nitrogen compounds; inhibits corrosive effects of oxygen with metals and decreases metal interaction with oxygen compounds to reduce oxidation of oil.

Oxidation Inhibitors (See Antioxidants).

Rust Inhibitor (Surface Protective Additive): Barium sulfonates, amine phosphates, phosphordithioates, sodium thizoles (for coolants),

Pour Point Depressant (Performance Additive): polymethacrylates (PMA's); reducing wax crystal formation and increases solvency of oil at low temperatures. May be part of VII package.

Seal Swell (Performance Additive): nitriles, specific esters, organic phosphates and aromatic hydrocarbons. Increases volume of elastomeric seals.

Surfactants or Surface Active Agents (Protective Additive): family of diphenylamines and amides; usually part of the antioxidant package. Also provides enhanced friction reduction and allows oils to "climb" or spread on and over surfaces. Decreases but does not destroy surface tension

Soot Control or Soot Inhibitor (Protective Additive for diesels): Organic Barium compounds; keeps soot in suspension. Usually part of the dispersant package in diesel formulations.

Tackifiers (Performance Enhancement): copolymers of ethylene and propylene; helps oil cling to surfaces. Very useful in geared machines such as transmissions, differentials, and chains.

Viscosity Index Improver or Viscosity Modifier (Performance Additive): Olefin copolymers (OCP's), hydrogentated styrene-diene copolymers, styrene esters, polymetharylates (PMA's), mixed alkyl methacrylate-vinyl-pyrrolidines, aminated ethylene propylene, mixed alkylmethacrylate ethylene/propylenes; reduces viscosity change with temperature. Increases viscosity of base oil as temperature rises when base oil tends to thin. Some VII's may also act as dispersants by incorporating dispersant compounds.

So as you can see there are multiple "friction modifying" agents in todays oils...like Rotella has no Moly but tons of Phospherus....Red Line oils have tons of Moly...both excellent wear prevention agents....you want the "whole" package.....rust inhibiters....
performance enahncers ( also classified often as friction modifiers)...etc.
The Virgin Oil Analysis done often are of "older" oils.....example would be Chevron Delo....last year no Moly...this years batch got gobs of Moly....I go to the manufacturers product spec sheets and watch.....also send in various oils for VOA's which often times are done for free to keep the labs database up too date....
Yes the oil companies dont give out there receipe for sure...so knuckleheads such as myself and many others send in "new" oil to see what is in it with the spectrum analyzer......some sad ass shit aint it:) Like Mobil 5000...loaded with salt...yes salt....
So the bottom line is this....you want..
1. Friction Modifiers
2. Cleaning Agents
3. Rust Inhibiters
4. Viscosity Enhancers to maintain viscosity and not "wear" out of grade...
Many oils have a couple of the main drivers covered but lack in other areas....so often times we will add say a Valvoline Oil Treatment to enhance the friction modifiers and cleaning agents of say a Pennzoil 10-40 dino.....or Castrol GTX....and voila...you get RedLine $6 buck a quart type of performance out of $10 bucks worth of Pennzoil....funny how this works aint it:)

[Bowtie Guy]

Sarge---you da man! And you got your chemical engineering degree where? Thanks for all the info--this has been a verrrry informative thread!
By the way, what is the problem with Mobil 1 and aircraft engines? I seem to remember (Brainfade) they bought a few engines a couple years ago on a class action suit, and they have a disclaimer now about aviation use.

[Sarge]

Sarge---you da man! And you got your chemical engineering degree where? Thanks for all the info--this has been a verrrry informative thread!
By the way, what is the problem with Mobil 1 and aircraft engines? I seem to remember (Brainfade) they bought a few engines a couple years ago on a class action suit, and they have a disclaimer now about aviation use.
The University of UnderTheFuckingHood :)
My degree isn't engineering.....but I have spent some time in the area of oil and it's abilities/reactions to the internal combustion engine that is for damn sure. The purpose of this string (to me anyway) is to get folks thinking/researching and learning...this prevents some INTERNET expert to come along and tell us all about the next best thing.....and they do on a daily basis....I believe the issue with Mobil 1 was its inability to deal with fuel and insolubles in the oil and the resulting failures associated with it....If I remember correctly......I dunno.....
Bottom line is....there is no one perfect or one BEST oil....I recommend oils based on answers to questions....and most of the times the oil I recommend may be different than the oil recommended to another...often times folks think I'm flip flopping when that is the farthest thing from the truth.....
I will share this...the lowest wear numbers and highest dyno numbers I have ever gotten in my Black Beast is this...
5qts Shell Rotella 15-40
2qts Amsoil 15-40 Diesel Marine
8ozs Valvoline SynPower Oil Treatment
Go figure:) If one uses the charts and info in this string you can tell really quick that the above "soup" is chalk full of additives.....that you cannot get in a single source oil.....

[Bowtie Guy]

Does UTFH have a fight song? Cheerleaders?

[Tobynine9]

Sarge, you need to patent that mixture and start your own motor oil company. That would give us someplace reliable to get our good stuff.

Sarge's Commercial:

(An Old Crazy Bastard lookalike lifts his head out from underneath the hood of a GTO while holding some random tool)

Sarge: Are you tired of having to sift through 39 pounds of bull sh** when looking for the best performance motor oil for your ride?

Until just recently, I was too. That's why we here at UTFH University created Sarge's Soup Motor Oil company...

(UTFH Cheerleaders dancing in the background)

[Sarge]

Yeah I need gearhead cheerleaders.....I nominate Keliente...oh shit....now she is gonna weld my lips shut and beat the crap outta me with her ratchet....

[98LSGUN]

Yeah I need gearhead cheerleaders.....I nominate Keliente...oh shit....now she is gonna weld my lips shut and beat the crap outta me with her ratchet....
:yup: she's gonna :ar: ya!

[Sarge]

Well lets see......On an "oil expert" board.......or should I say not a LS1 board.....
I invited this fella here.....I think he is tired of the very internet expert bullshit....so I share with you...I wont link to the other board...I think most of you folks can figure it out.....The string............
Hello,
I really like your GTO! That is a Sweet ride! I noticed you posted in MY LS1 Used oil analysis topic. I paied Terry to look at it every time but I'm being told every time my wear #'s are high because of fuel dilution. I had the Dealer check for everything and they said fuel trim levels are great and everything is normal. I have been using GC for a while now wil poor results.
What oil do you think would be good in my LS1? I'm about to the point to where I will start to mod my car(2002 Z28). Looks like you know what you are doing in the mod dept! What have you doen to your car and what would you reccomend I start with? Thanks! Chris ................

Me ( The Old Fart)
Hey Chris...firstly...I dont put much value on Terry and his "thoughts" as they pertain to engines....He is comparing your LS1 to a fricking 4 cylinder Toyota and making those remarks.....but I digress....your wear numbers are high because your engine flat doesnt care for a 30 weight.....Seriously...I would try Castrol GTX 10-40 or Pennzoil 10-40 with about 6-7 oz of Valvoline Synpower Oil Treatment in there......(or about half the 15oz bottle).....go 3-4K and I gurantee you will have an excellent UOA....I run Shell Rotella 15-40 with excellent results....beat the crap out of Amsoil UOA's and GC UOA's....The mods on the GTO...well that is a very lengthy list...crank/pistons/rods/piston rings/heads/cam/intakes/valves/valve springs/trannie/driveshaft/springs/shocks/rear ends etc.etc.etc.....puts down over 600RWHP as she sits.....the rear view mirror is stock...that's about it...we all hang out over at ls1.com....I'm known as Sarge there...stop on by...

Him...............
Hi Sarge,
I'm starting to doubt Terry as well. I do everything he tels me to and my UOA'so not improve! I'm tired of paying him $40 to tell me info that does not work. He told me I'm getting high wear because of fuel dilution even though no fuel was found in the oil. He said my coils, sparkplugs, PVC ect were all shot and worn out at 30,000 miles. Had the dealer check them all out and they said the car was running like a champ, fuel trim levels were all 100% good. When I told him this he said the dealer was wrong. I'm not going to use him any longer as I have to much doubt in him now.
I like castrol GTX. It has given me extreemly low wear in my 1997 Tahoe 350(Iron 4, Chromium 1, Aluminum 3, Copper 2, Lead 3, ect in 3,000 miles consistantly! I dont think you can beat that in a 350.
Should I stick with a Synthetic or go Dino with 3,000 mile changes? What other oil would be a good choice for my LS1? Mobil 1 5w40, Castrol GTX 5w40, Halvoilne? My lowest UOA was with regular dino Halvoline right after the engine was rebuilt under warranty for oil burning, it looked like this: Iron 9, Aluminium 2, Chromium 1, Copper 52, Lead 4.
Thanks alot!

Me............
Well friend.....you are a victim of the internet "dogpile"......this guy is full of **** and this guy is an "expert".....this oil is friking great and this oil is ****...."if you love your car you will only use synthetics".....
listen son...and I mean this....you put Castrol GTX 10-40 in your LS1...you get a bottle of Valvoline Synpower Oil Treatment from AutoZone or NAPA....NAPA will order it for you ....you fill your ride with whatever the normal fill is....6 qts or whatever and add the VSOT 8ozs to it.....you run that for 3K or even 4K......send a sample to BlackStone Labs.....$20 bucks....
http://www.blackstone-labs.com/
Here it is....if that UOA doesnt come back with the numbers that beat the **** out of your previous numbers you can blast my *** on all the web sites....ls1.com ....BITOG all of em....I'm no internet ********...just a knucklehead who loves fast cars and knows oil.....**** them internet expert sum biatches....

.............
Well...he is a good kid and a victim of yet more internet bullshit.....let's see what happens....and will you knuckleheads be good for once...this is a fellow LS1'r!!!
Merry Christmas to you lil shits by the way......go change your oil and STFU...

[bad6as]

all thoes lil lables on teh oild bottles are crap,
suv,truck, and mini van
eurapien (sp)
new car
older car
5-30 is 5-30 and extera dont let thoes things fool you
if you want syntetic 5-40 and if it says made for germen cars its b.s its syn 5-40

[02SlamAirTA]

My LS1 gets Royal Purple Synthetic.
My grocery getter minivan gets dino.
My commuter (25K+ p/year) gets blended dino/synthetic off the shelf.
All get WIX filters and all get changed every 3K miles.

[Hurley711]

Just switched to Mobil 1 this morning:yup:

[HAWKNYU]

Amsoil 0w-30 in every engine I have, including my generator and change it once a year. Amsoil fluids in every thing else except power steering,'cause they don't make it yet. So, I'm still using Redline synthetic power steering fluid. I also use Valvoline syntetic brake fluid in my truck.

[GatorSS]

The University of UnderTheFuckingHood :)
My degree isn't engineering.....but I have spent some time in the area of oil and it's abilities/reactions to the internal combustion engine that is for damn sure. The purpose of this string (to me anyway) is to get folks thinking/researching and learning...this prevents some INTERNET expert to come along and tell us all about the next best thing.....and they do on a daily basis....
:yup: :thumbup: A++ Sarge...great info and your purpose is right on the mark. Thinking/researching and learning is critical and you've done a fine job on this thread nurturing it (no matter what Zboner says). All your oil "soup" research is incredibly helpful, much more so than all those self-proclaimed "experts" trolling around.

And everyone else (just the big people), keep the questions/comments coming.

[TwistedSS]

What kinda filters do yall use? I use ACDELCO or K+N for oil, and K+N for air

[HAWKNYU]

I use AC-Delco Duraguard Gold, cause I bought 2 cases of them just before they stopped making them for oil filters and I use the Donaldson re-cleanable for air.

[chrisj6]

I am using M1 0w-40 in my 99 Z71, works great with no consumption.

Chris

[BADBLUE02]

Always used Mobile 1

[Tobynine9]

Can you mix oil weights? I have a whole case of RP 10-30 and everyone seems to be agreeing that 40 weights are better for the LS1.

I ask because it's been burning oil lately. Tomorrow I'll be replacing the PCV and installing a filter/trip inline to the TB but using a thicker oil apparently helps too, from what I read.

[chrisj6]

I am using 0w-40 for my 5.3L truck and it seems to burn more than with 5w-30 which was almost nil. I would suggest 5w-40 to start and see how that goes. I guess you could mix what you have with maybe two or so quarts of 10w-40 or 5w-40 and see how that goes.

[Sarge]

Can you mix oil weights? I have a whole case of RP 10-30 and everyone seems to be agreeing that 40 weights are better for the LS1.

I ask because it's been burning oil lately. Tomorrow I'll be replacing the PCV and installing a filter/trip inline to the TB but using a thicker oil apparently helps too, from what I read.
RP 10-30 has shown to shear down to a lighter viscosity...this shearing is not found in any of the RP Racing Oils.....
Now before I threw out perfectly good RP 10-30 I would AUto RX that motor...use Castrol 10-30 dino oil for the cleaning and rinse cycles...then go back to your RP 10-30 and see where we are at....how long have you been running RP 10-30? Many times a good synthetic will clean the seals and a leak sprouts up or the piston rings get free allowing blow by and a engine begins burning oil....I would also check your PCV valve...blow through it....is it restrictive? Crankcase pressure will cause oil "back burnning" in the cylinders....

[Tobynine9]

I've been running the RP 10-30 for about... 6k miles. No leaks from any external seals. The sooty, stinky exhaust has ceased since I replaced the PCV valve and installed an AMW catch can. When I disconnected the line from the PCV to the intake, oil dripped from the male end of the intake connection.

The previous owner put nothing but Mobil 1 5-30 in it, per conventional lay wisdom.

I just SeaFoamed it yesterday. It's already running smoother. I'll be sure to SeaFoam again when the mosquitoes have done their annual reinfestation.

So, I'll include an auto-rx cycle before/with the next oil change and use Castrol dino oil. I have no real intention of simply throwing away $70 worth of RP 10-30. That's why I ask if it's ok to mix and if so, what would be a recommended combination? I do use VSOT.

[Tobynine9]

Anybody? Anything to mix with the RP 10-30 to compensate for the shearing breakdown?

Also, do y'all recirculate the oil caught in your AMW cans or do you just throw it out? Less than 500 miles since the install and I'm already looking at 1/2" of oil in the bottom of the darn thing.

[Judge Smales]

any updates on the new GC 0W30. I just picked up the last 10 quarts at autozone and wanted to know how it did. If it's still the good stuff then I will continue looking for more.

[Sarge]

Anybody? Anything to mix with the RP 10-30 to compensate for the shearing breakdown?

Also, do y'all recirculate the oil caught in your AMW cans or do you just throw it out? Less than 500 miles since the install and I'm already looking at 1/2" of oil in the bottom of the darn thing.
I save up my oil out of the catch can and pour it down my neighbors well...she is an asshole.....
Yes...1 oz of Valvoline Synthetic Oil Treatment....to each quart of oil...
http://www.valvoline.com/pages/products/product_detail.asp?product=21
Absolutely the finest oil additive there is...big dose of Moly...damn good stuff....
Get it at Auto Zone or NAPA....my NAPA orders it for me....it will keep you in grade and reduce friction significantly.....pour it on your Fruit Loops....it is the real deal....

[Sarge]

any updates on the new GC 0W30. I just picked up the last 10 quarts at autozone and wanted to know how it did. If it's still the good stuff then I will continue looking for more.
Yeah...the VOA's look good....strong additive packs for sure....I havent seen a UOA on it yet...but the VOA's look like a very strong 0-30....
By the way...I just sold 42 quarts of the 04 ( Green Stuff) to a guy for $3.50 a quart.....

[Judge Smales]

Yeah...the VOA's look good....strong additive packs for sure....I havent seen a UOA on it yet...but the VOA's look like a very strong 0-30....
By the way...I just sold 42 quarts of the 04 ( Green Stuff) to a guy for $3.50 a quart.....
So is the green stuff still better? I just picked up a 1999 SS Convertible which is all stock with a castrol syntec sticker from the factory under the hood. Will the new GC 0W30 be ok in it?

[Sarge]

Oh yeah.....no doubt....it has the exact same characteristics ( Viscosity/friction modifiers/cleaning agents etc.) as the green stuff....run it with no worries at all....

[Judge Smales]

Oh yeah.....no doubt....it has the exact same characteristics ( Viscosity/friction modifiers/cleaning agents etc.) as the green stuff....run it with no worries at all....
Thanks Sarge! How well would it work in my 02 2500HD with the 6.0 in it. I have been running Mobil 1 10W30 in, but would change to GC 0W30 if it would be ok to run it while towing. Any thoughts on that?

[Sarge]

Thanks Sarge! How well would it work in my 02 2500HD with the 6.0 in it. I have been running Mobil 1 10W30 in, but would change to GC 0W30 if it would be ok to run it while towing. Any thoughts on that?
I went over and had a look see at other Chevy 2500HD's UOA's.....
about a dozen or so.....here is one comparing Mobil and Pennzoil DINO....
2000 Chev Silverado 4x4 ext cab Truck with 4.8ltr V-8, 5 speed, Manual Transfer case that I ordered. Driven approx 120 miles once a week at the least and a couple of short trips a week too. Less than 10%.

Bought new, changed the oil at 1k, 3k, 6k and went to Mobil 1 5-30w Tri-syn and changed at 5k segments. At 23.5k, went to Pennzoil 10-30w Dino.

Below is the Orginal Mobil 1 Test and the Pennzoil Test.

Miles on Truck/Miles on Oil;

23.5k/3.5k Mobil 1, 28.6k/3.3k Pennzoil


Results ppm/% Comments (blank=normal)(x=Not tested)
Wear
Copper 27,21
Iron 9,6
Chromium 1,0
Lead 2,2
Aluminum 2,2
Silicon 0,3
Tin 2,x

Additives
Molybdenum 2,79
Sodium 7,x
Magnesium 1130,28
Zinc 651,988
Potassium 16,x
Phosphorus 574,853
Calcium 763,2108

Physical Properties
Water negative, 0
Fuel negative, 0
Antifreeze negative, 0
Soot/solids 0,x
Oxidation 52,0
Nitration 134,0
Sulfur 0,22
TBN 9,x
Vis@100 C (cSt) 10.1,9.44


There was a Oil change at 25k with the Pennzoil so there was a change between these two UOAs.

Fuel Milage has been the same to a little bit better, so much for this outfit getting better gas mileage on 100% Syn oil....

I plan to change the oil when it's got 3-4k miles or 4-5 months which ever comes first and UOA once or twice a year just to keep up with the trend.

I changed it to Pennzoil 5-30w for the winter and will run 10-30w during the rest of the year.

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Damn good wear...the Pennzoil Dino did most excellent.....I'd say you should be good for a fairly extended OCI for sure....So to answer your question....the cSt@100c for this used oil (both) were around 10.0...the GC will probably beat that....based on that I'd run it for 5K and go from there.....get a UOA and lets see....I bet you'll find the GC does well in that motor...

[Judge Smales]

Thanks again Sarge! Now all I have to do is find more of it!! The search continues tomorrow.

[Judge Smales]

Anybody ever heard of or used purepower oil filters. They say they are cleanable and reusable. They also say they are about 90% more efficent at filtering then throw away filters. I haven't used them, just stumbled across there site and was wondering.

[02z28ls1]

Pure Power Lifetime Filter System--There is a quick test in the Test and Tune section of the April 06 (newest)issue of HotRod magazine(pg 130).Looks impressive.

[mo gomez]

ive always used mobil 1 synthetic; thats what gm uses for a reason they think it will cause less failures and lower rate of warranty repairs. thay also use synthetic diff, fluid in all the car and trucks since 2000 for the same reason lower failure rates.

[Sarge]

ive always used mobil 1 synthetic; thats what gm uses for a reason they think it will cause less failures and lower rate of warranty repairs. thay also use synthetic diff, fluid in all the car and trucks since 2000 for the same reason lower failure rates.
If your saying GM uses Mobil 1 cuz it is the best available oil out there...man you need to learn about marketing and sales.
What characteristics does Mobil 1 present to you to make this assumption of superior performance say over a Red Line/Royal Purple or a Dino Castrol? UOA's/VOA's do not support your statement at all.
I love a generic definitive statment.....
" they think it will cause less failures and lower rate of warranty repairs. thay also use synthetic diff, fluid in all the car and trucks since 2000 for the same reason lower failure rates."
Who is they?
Lower failure rates compared to what?
GM DOES NOT put synthetics in every car and truck delivered since 2000....quite the opposite....only the Vette/That funky lil truck and the 05 and above GTO come with synthetic...ALL THE REST COME WITH DINO OIL.
I await your response.

[Hi-Po]

cough** cough** just keep waitin.

[thelug]

all my cars mobile 1 every mile on the ticker

[Sarge]

all my cars mobile 1 every mile on the ticker
I know a LS1 with over 200K on the clicker...nothing but Pennzoil Dino 10-30 from day one. So what do we do now? Sorta an empty ass statement wouldn't you say?

[RainMan]

I don't know, seems everyone has their preference. Everything from el-cheapo generic Dino oil to Royal Purple??

Here's my $.02 worth.

VALVOLINE SYN POWER Fully Synthetic in all the Cars.:yup:
'86 IROC-Z - 10W30 Year Round
'04 Monte Carlo SS - 5W30 Year Round
'02 WS6 T/A - 10W30 Mar - Oct / 5W30 Nov - Feb (On 5W30 right now)

No LS1 Piston Slap :)
No LS1 Oil consumption*:)

VALVOLINE SYN POWER Fully Synthetic 75W-140 Limited Slip Gear Oil in the T/A & IROC (W/ P-Trac Additive) No more rear end howl!:yup:

*Have read many posts about guys with low, mid, and high mileage LSX engines consuming as much as 1 quart a month! :Ohno: I don't know. Mine has no noticeable loss of oil at all! :)
Changed oil 1600 miles ago and still at top of hash marks. :) Have not added a drop! Only use WIX filters from Central Auto Parts down in Cocoa. :)

I can understand High mileage oil consumption, but the rest, with no obvious engine problems or leaks??? They all seem to think it's normal?? Someone even said that GM said that a quart every 1500 miles or so is normal?? WTF over?? :dunno:

Not complaining, just trying to understand why oil consumption seems to be a common occurrence with the LSX engines and mine apparently doesn't use a drop (an obvious exaggeration, of course it uses a little, but not noticeable on the dipstick).

The only oil consumption issues I've ever had were with a high mileage '97 Grand Prix GT, and when I had bad intake valve stem seals on the IROC. Replaced them with viton seals and problem went away.

As far as my LS1, my only guess is that I drive the T/A as daily driver. 18 miles each way to work then home at 50-70MPH. Oil has chance to fully warm up.:dunno: SWAG (Scientific Wild Assed Guess)

IROC has run VALVOLINE Synthetic since the engine went in in 1993, still clean as the day I put it in.

I'm happy with it, guess that what counts in the end!

My $.02

[02z28ls1]

Any alloy block engine has to be built with extra clearances to anticipate the extra expansion and contraction that occurs in an alloy block. So some extra oil consumption can occur during warm up driving.A small price to pay IMHO for the weight savings.

[RainMan]

Any alloy block engine has to be built with extra clearances to anticipate the extra expansion and contraction that occurs in an alloy block. So some extra oil consumption can occur during warm up driving.A small price to pay IMHO for the weight savings.

Yea, I know about that, I'm just puzzled as to why mine seems to be an exception to the norm. And the 1 quart to every 1500 miles still seems a tad excessive for modern High perf engines. IMHO

[sonnyred]

My ls1 dos'nt have piston slap nor does it burn oil,and dos'nt leak.Mobil 1 all the way.

[Sarge]

The "trick" or "secret" to a good claen running engine is reasonable Oil Change Intervals ( OCI) with a SM API rated oil. There is no "best" oil....synthetic or dino....

[0to60n4.5]

Hey Smales , I got a $100.00 bucks says you slice .:)

[Judge Smales]

Hey Smales , I got a $100.00 bucks says you slice .:)
Gambling is illegeal at "Bushwood" and I never "Slice"...

I was also wondering if everybody is using 5.5 quarts with stock filter or can we squeeze in the full 6 quarts? I also like your new avatar Sarge.

[0to60n4.5]

That was the reply that I thought I might get ....... Thanks.

[Chuck02WS6]

Did the change to Amsoil 0-30W with a K & N filter over the weekend.
Turns out a NAPA store a few miles from my house is a Amsoil dealer.
Motor seems to run quieter and smoother after the change. Thanks
to Sarge and the rest of you for providing a very helpful and imformative
thread, probably the best I've seen on this site so far. :)

[Bowtie Guy]

My local Chevy dealer puts Pennzoil Synthetic blend 5W30 in everything that doesnt get Mobil 1 factory fill. That was what was in it when I bought it. I usually get my oil changed at a Valvoline Instant Oil Change near home. I checked the specs on both oils (Valvoline Durablend 5W30) and from what I can discern, its a wash. I know that the add packs are proprietary trade secrets. Change intervals are 3K. Whaddaya think,Sarge?