6 speed auto in 4th Gen?

[matthijsgrit]

I was wondering:
what will it take to swap my 4 speed auto for a modern 6 speed, like the 6L80?
Can it be done?
Should I or should I not want this?

Mg

[mark21742]

I've wondered tge same thing about my 04 GTO.
I know in the hptuners program there are some settings for 5th and 6th gear

[JaycenK]

Mechanically I can't imagine that the motor side stuff would be all that different because it is an LSX motor it comes on. Only thing you may need is a different controller, mod the trans braket, resize the drive shaft and maybe change the input yoke. The TC, flex and pump shaft length should be spot on.

[c5z28]

They do sell a kit from a corvette. Do not know the name of the company but it can be done.

[matthijsgrit]

thanks so far, more info is welcome!
What would it mean performance-wise (accelleration, top speed) and in terms of fuel consumption?

[c5z28]

Not really sure, all I know is there optional 2.73 gear would make our stock 3.23 a little faster. I would have to imagine better gearing but I am going to have to look that info up.

[mark21742]

thanks so far, more info is welcome!
What would it mean performance-wise (accelleration, top speed) and in terms of fuel consumption?

if I am correct the 6 speed gives you a steeper 1st gear, slightly closer gear ratio, so you get to keep the motor at peak power better and turn lower rpms in 6th

a6 ratio's
(1st) 4.484
(2nd) 2.872
(3rd) 1.842
(4th) 1.414
(5th) 1.000
(6th) 0.742
(reverse)2.88


a4 ratio's
(1st) 3.06
(2nd)1.63
(3rd) 1.00
(4th) 0.70
(reverse) 2.29

[Lanaue]

I was looking into doing the same to my 3rd gen Z28. Just give them about 6-8 months and someone will have a kit.You know it's been asked.

[c5z28]

I was looking into doing the same to my 3rd gen Z28. Just give them about 6-8 months and someone will have a kit.You know it's been asked.

There is a kit it even comes with those paddle shifters-I just don't know the name.

[mark21742]

with the 4.484 1st gear, you wouldn't need 411's would you lol

[c5z28]

with the 4.484 1st gear, you wouldn't need 411's would you lol

You wouldn't want 3.73's

[JaycenK]

You wouldn't want 3.73's

Well.... I have a 2007 tundra and it has a 5 speed auto and one of the things that caught my attention was the 4.10 rear gear and the 3.8X first gear. It is wild but works out great any more gear and it would be a waist but that is just right for the power of the 4.7 motor and the wieght of the truck for what it needs to do. I would say your right about the 4.10's but depending on the power you are making 3.73's may be right on the money. If you make more power I would say 3.23 or 3.50 or so would fit better but then it still depends on engine setup. boost motors like less gear because they have a chance to build full boost before a shift point. Cool Idea though

[SHines-IT]

There is a kit it even comes with those paddle shifters-I just don't know the name.

I saw this somewhere to, it's saved on an old computer, but I got mad and broke it.

[c5z28]

I saw this somewhere to, it's saved on an old computer, but I got mad and broke it.

?

http://i827.photobucket.com/albums/zz193/kkorkki/Officespace.jpg

[346ci]

I think the swap would be quit involved as the 6L80 has an internal TCM in the valve body controlling it. Where as the 4th gens has a PCM controlling the trans. I dont think you could tie in the 6L80's TCM with a 4th gen PCM, much less there being a way to tune it.

Unless there is some aftermarket conversion kit I am unaware of, I think you would need an ECM and harness that is compatible with the 6l80's TCM, such as one from an LS3 that is designed to operate with that trans. I could be wrong, but I think it may be more headache and cost than it's worth.

[mark21742]

I think the swap would be quit involved as the 6L80 has an internal TCM in the valve body controlling it. Where as the 4th gens has a PCM controlling the trans. I dont think you could tie in the 6L80's TCM with a 4th gen PCM, much less there being a way to tune it.

Unless there is some aftermarket conversion kit I am unaware of, I think you would need an ECM and harness that is compatible with the 6l80's TCM, such as one from an LS3 that is designed to operate with that trans. I could be wrong, but I think it may be more headache and cost than it's worth.

I know there are companies that offer tranny controllers for the 4l60e in older cars for $400-$600, I'm sure they have them for the 6 speed too

[Cutlass]

Google a company called Speartech

[Cutlass]

I did some research and it seems that its most common to get a engine control module that is compatible with the existing trans module built into the 6L80e. Sounds like the 6L80e's shift setup and controls are very complex.

[JaycenK]

I did some research and it seems that its most common to get a engine control module that is compatible with the existing trans module built into the 6L80e. Sounds like the 6L80e's shift setup and controls are very complex.

Sorry cutlass I have read that statement and for some reason I just cant figure it out. Are you saying that you can get a Factory ECM that can control the 6L80E and the Ls1's in an F body? or that you need an after market companies controller for both engine and trans? or did I just flat out have a brain fart and misunderstand that all together?
I may be loosing it :screwy:

[mark21742]

Sorry cutlass I have read that statement and for some reason I just cant figure it out. Are you saying that you can get a Factory ECM that can control the 6L80E and the Ls1's in an F body? or that you need an after market companies controller for both engine and trans? or did I just flat out have a brain fart and misunderstand that all together?
I may be loosing it :screwy:

stock computer out of a car that came with an a6 would work.
you'd probably need the matching wiring harness too

[Cutlass]

The 6L80e has a transmission control module(TCM) built into it. It needs info from the Engine Control Module (ECM) to figure out when and how to shift. The LS1 ECMs can't properly communicate with the 6L80e TCM so a stock ECM out of a car/truck that came with an a6 or an an aftermarket ECM is needed. The newer ECM needs to replace the stock LS1 computer and needs to be programmed to run the engine and talk to the TCM. Most likely the new ECM has different connectors so a new wire harness is necessary.

[JaycenK]

ok I get it now. Cool thanks for that

[SINISTER-TA]

There is a kit it even comes with those paddle shifters-I just don't know the name.

I know TCI makes a 6 speed auto that's suppose to work with LS engines. Better have deep pockets though.

http://www.tciauto.com/WhatsNew/Files/tci6xsixspeedautomatictransmission.pdf

[fieropope]

the new a6s fall under the new CAN regulations and the tcm comunication rate is in the 1mbps range and our cars are at i think the 512kbps range. so the trans controller module would almost have to be a stand alone and youd have to tap into the sensors of the car. IE tps,ect,maf,you get the point. Im not saying it cant be done the impossible can always be possible with money.

[allbaugh_04]

With that kind of first gear, i'd love to have a six speed. Too bad they couldn't make 6th a little bit taller though.

[mark21742]

With that kind of first gear, i'd love to have a six speed. Too bad they couldn't make 6th a little bit taller though.

I know, till i found and posted the ratios i thought it was setup more like the M6 with two overdrives......but hey with that tall of a 1st gear you can make up for it with your rear gears with no problem

[kaine806]

I was looking into doing this swap but gave up after finding out the the transmissions are around 6grand in stock form... and I would just break that one...lol.. I did find a few in some junk yard's in the dallas area for around 3500 but still it would cost another 2grand to have it built up to where I would need it..

but that first gear would be nice... if you do the math I beleave that if you run 3.23's in the rear it's = to 4.56's in first gear and when you get on the HWY the cruising RPM's a great as long as your not running a big cam...
you can search on hotrod.com and GMtech and they have done a few F-body swap's with these.. but after every thing was done they spent just under 10grand doing it.

[tylerdurden1]

There was an article in a mag cant remember the name, want to say Camaro. It showed step to step on install with aftermarket torque brace/ tunnel well ect. If you can put a old school th400 and 4l80e in them, the real question is the cost worth it.

[00z28bubba]

4l80 is a 4 speed. Its actually not a ridiculous swap. A handful of people here have it or are under construction